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Stargate Information Archive _ Atlantis Season 2 _ 213 - Critical Mass
Posted by: Arcady Nov 29th 2005, 1:27 PM
Season 2, Episode 13 - Critical Mass
Air Dates:
CA: Dec. 5, 8 PM (TMN)
US: Jan. 20, 9 PM (Sci Fi Channel)
UK: Jan. 25, 8 PM (Sky One)
When a beacon is set off alerting the Wraith to Atlantis' presence, suspicion is thrown on a newcomer from Earth.
http://www.sg1archive.com/atlantis/s2.shtml#213 | http://www.sg1archive.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=12175 | http://www.sg1archive.com/teasers/a213.html
(This topic is for people who have seen the episode to discuss it. If you don't want to be spoiled, don't read this topic.)
Posted by: Auntie Em! Dec 5th 2005, 9:56 PM
Cavanough.... me thinks he is an ass. I love when the Asgard look up and tells him to "stop talking please. Thank you."
I almost peed my pants when they were just about to push the engage button to earth and McKay yells. "STOP". I got chills all over. Oh my when the gate started to dial itself without the ZPM I was oh my goodness. The NID are nasty asses. Sneaky.
I loved seeing the SGC in the episodes. Not for a few seconds either but quite a bit there.
I thought that Cadmin was the one who planeted the bomb but when I saw Cavaungh I thought imediately that it was that slimy ass kissing moron of a man. What is with Cadmin suddenly being an explosive expert? 
It was suspicious that Cavanagh kept coming and going from Atlantis. Begging to come back to Atlanis after he begged to leave after "The Siege" only to stay for 3 weeks before begging to leave again. The guy is an ass. What was in those encryptic messages he did send. He may not have planeted the failsafe code in the end but something is pretty fishy with him. He is a wimp for passing out also. *Shivers* I cannot stand him.
Lots of good Big D shots. Love that they used them to relay the messages back and forth. Funny how the Big D left back for Atlantis without permission.
This was a very good Teyla episode. Why so many hate her I do not understand. The Ring ceramony, it was beautiful. Teyla singing. WOW. Galic in nature. It was awesome. Great to get a Telya story.
No bomb? Just screwing with the power flow regulators? The goa'uld rewrote the program surrrounding the ZPM securing it with a failsafe code. I was like what about the captain of the Big D. Caldwell. How come no one suspected him. As I said I got suspicious when the Big D turned to come back to Atlantis leaving the SGC in the lurch. When they beamed him out I knew it. When his eyes glowed I was like HOLEY sh*t! Smart move with the tazer gun as that has been well established in Stargate SG-1. I loved the interplay bewteen the ceramony and hightening tension of a impending wraith attack.
Zelinka 
How funny was he in all those little pigtails. How pissed at McKay was he! Nice that McKay did not save the day but rather a junior character.
Posted by: Gary2185 Dec 6th 2005, 12:50 AM
Didn't see that ending coming. Didnt think it was Cadmin, and Cavanagh was suspicious and still seems suspicious with coming and going like that and the encrypted messages. Overall I thought it was one of the better episodes so far this season.
Posted by: CrazySac Dec 6th 2005, 8:46 AM
Intresting episode Cadmin now that was out of left field i wouldn't have guessed it. honestly I don't see why the Goa'uld would even bother with Atlantis worrying about the wraith is small potatoes now that there empire is dead . Even with that those Goa'uld that are kissing some ori ass wouldn't fear the likes of thw wraith. I thought earlier this year when i heard a Goa'uld was coming to Atlantis, I had a kinda hope it would be on our side and stay as a recurring role. I would actually be intrested in seeing a single tokra around since we got an asguard around.
As for Cavanagh that guy is a, hoot during that entire time I was thinking back at how back when they were first sending messeging back to earth. Cavanagh sat there and bitched about the higher archy of atlantis and Ford said something like I'll leave you to whine in peace or something of that sort.
The entire Teyla part was intresting but I dont know it really fits with the stargate world .. a lil celtic music .. I felt like i was sitting in a coffee shop listening to Enya or something.
Zelinka lmao those kids did a number to him. I hope he brought alot of choclate cause you know those kids were prolly pissed when they ran out of the candy the sga-1 left them that one day.
Posted by: Muskusrat Dec 6th 2005, 9:04 AM
So let me get this correct, frist the 2 cruisers where attacking each other, then after a day or so they picked up the beacon, stopped attacking each other and went to check it out. Cruisers must have very strong shields cause they didnt show any damage what so ever. And how retarted are the wraith anyway? You pickup a distress call from the planet where you enemy is and you only "scan" it. Hell first thing I would try is dial the startgate (they surely got the adress). They would instantly know that the startgate was still there.
Anyway still nice episode would have though the guild would try to get there hands on a wraith has host, that would have been realy sweet.
Posted by: Circe Dec 6th 2005, 9:52 AM
This was a very good Teyla episode. Why so many hate her I do not understand. The Ring ceramony, it was beautiful. Teyla singing. WOW. Galic in nature. It was awesome. Great to get a Telya story.
I loved the interplay bewteen the ceramony and hightening tension of a impending wraith attack.
Zelinka
How funny was he in all those little pigtails. How pissed at McKay was he! Nice that McKay did not save the day but rather a junior character.
I thought this would have been a great episode if it had not been for all tht Tayla stuff. I hated the singing. I cringed and had to mute the TV. It was so stupid It ruined the entire episode!
I was almost at the point where I did not hate Tayla anymore but my hate has returned full force. I hate her. I so want her to be replacd by Cadman. That would be great because of the tension between McKay and her. But I loved Zelenka. They should put him in more shows. I love him to bits.
I also loved that Wier was all hard core in this episode. It shows she can be tough when she needas to be. I used to hate her in the first season but now I think she is great
Posted by: man named enis Dec 6th 2005, 10:10 AM
Damn that was a good episode!! Pity it was ruined by the singing bit..... It really just didn't fit into the show and when it started I was like "WTF?!"
What was with the taser thing? How did that give Caldwell the ability to speak even though the Goa'uld was inside him?
EDIT: Oh and forgot to add, I hope Cadman becomes a regular. She's a hottie! 
Posted by: Yamarin Dec 6th 2005, 3:18 PM
I liked the singing...wonder if it was actually her singing...
Posted by: rkenshin Dec 6th 2005, 3:46 PM
Couldn't they have used the biometric sensor if there was a slight chance that it was a Goa'uld in their midst..
Posted by: man named enis Dec 6th 2005, 6:17 PM
I mean I didnt' hate the music or anything, it was actually pretty good and fitted the situation well (and was well timed). It was just the fact that one of the characters was actually singing it that made me cringe.
Posted by: Auntie Em! Dec 6th 2005, 8:38 PM
That was the actor singing herself. No dubbing. I thought it was great. It let you know more about the people. SGA needs variety and it was nice to get that. I am glad the wraith know about Atlantis again. It has been a first dry season up to 210. Second half has been much better.
Also the Tazer, Zat has been shown to knock down a goa'uld enough for the host to come through for a short period of time. So that was not out of left field.
The wraith are territorial and have fought each other but like two brothers fighting when someone outside the family tries to attack either of them the other will come to their brothers assistance. So they quit their squabbling and went after a common enemy.
Posted by: Yamarin Dec 6th 2005, 10:26 PM
I think it adds a bit of humanity to the show, which again adds credibility to the whole thing...that is the small details that we take for granted in everyday life which are seldom displayed in shows like this...
We don't really know that the wraith know of Atlantis...yet (unless that was a spoiler) as they showed no sign of detecting anything...nor do we know if they actually followed op Mckays plan to hide a beacon amongst debris on themainland shore.
However we didn't really see the Wraith cruisers leave either...they might still be there in the next ep. which would explain why
edit: unquote bugged
Posted by: ha'tak Dec 7th 2005, 12:16 AM
that was a good EP
never in my wildest dreams saw Caldwell comming It was like a smack in the face. It was great
I loved Lee trying to expalin the comunication thing and the scientists
Lee: they send a message all across the country side....... Lord of the Rings, [all scientis nodd in approval] Lord of the Rings you know when they light all those signals on the top of the mountain tops, you saw that right
landry: People, People People
Also the sceen when they're about dial Earth the hand just above the button reminded me of the movie Mission Impossible
It seems like im the only one In America who sees these
Posted by: JaffaKree Dec 7th 2005, 12:38 AM
Lee: they send a message all across the country side....... Lord of the Rings, [all scientis nodd in approval] Lord of the Rings you know when they light all those signals on the top of the mountain tops, you saw that right
landry: People, People People
That was the best part of the episode. That and Caldwell with the eye flash, though I wish Sheppard had pulled out a zat instead of a taser. I miss zats.
Posted by: Raxor Dec 7th 2005, 2:44 PM
good ep, it thought it was the person inside mkay at the start, as most shows show the person who is the enemy right at the start. nice way to be out of a cliche and good variety
***
not bad :)
Posted by: yoruk Dec 7th 2005, 4:50 PM
Dang, that song was really nice. I'm dying to find it on the net. Does anyone know where I might be able to get it?
Posted by: hobo_joe20 Dec 7th 2005, 4:51 PM
I thought this episode seemed a little too strewn together at the last minute. They had some good ideas, but IMO didn't do a very good job tying them together even with themselves. It just seemed .... broken. I will give the writers credit for coming up with something more complicated than just "there's a bomb!".
The Teyla part at the end just didn't seem to fit. The writers need to give/find her a place in this show. It seems like Ronan has taken over her role from Season 1, and now she's left with nothing left to do. Just strewn into random plot lines with no importance.
Still, it did have its moments. Zelenka at the end, the "twilight bark" bit, and Ronan kicking some ass out of Codwell. 
Overall, I give this episode a 5/10.
Posted by: rkenshin Dec 7th 2005, 6:09 PM
Well if you read the spoiler thread for this ep, you'd see that the original plot is way different to the one that we saw..
Posted by: Auntie Em! Dec 7th 2005, 10:28 PM
Hobo doesn't read any spoilers. He is the spoiler police!
Though, I have to disagree with you Hobo. I did not feel it was disjoined. I cannot think of how it felt that way. What scenes made you think that?
Posted by: hobo_joe20 Dec 7th 2005, 11:01 PM
and there's a problem there?
Someone has to stand up for those of us who prefer to not be spoiled and IMO ruin the episode in advance! I like being suprised!It was mainly just how the major plot lines were revealed to us. Oh, there's a bomb eh? and we can't dial Atlantis? [enter joke about 101 dalmations] ok, so no bomb anymore?
it just seemed so .... random to me. and so sudden as to how they arrived at their next conclusion. I fon't really know how else to explain it .....
Posted by: ted_simple Dec 8th 2005, 1:56 AM
***
not bad :)
It's funny you should say that, I thought the same. Usually they say "there is an intruder!" and with the next scene cut, you see him. So I also suspected Cadmin. Glad it wasn't her.
I loved the Lord Of the Rings signal fire thingie.
Posted by: Auntie Em! Dec 8th 2005, 2:27 AM
You see I did not get the Lord of the Ring thingy I have not seen it. Only peices of it. I got the Dalmation thing though! Ruff.
Hobo I was not making fun of you. I was defending you you silly. 
I think maybe what you were feeling was that it was suppose to be a 2 hour show squished into an hour. That kinda feeling?
Posted by: Hazaa3000 Dec 8th 2005, 4:55 AM
Good episode, however I must ask
"When did the Trust / Gou'ald learn how to reprogram Ancient Technology?" It would seem almost impossible, unless they had some of the Ancient's computers and all. I just felt it was a rather, "Lets put a twist in but not really think it through."
Also, the singing, at first I was like o dear.... but then I felt it really added to the atmosphere of the episode.
How did they think an evacuation would help? Surely the Wraith would see the ships leaving????
They also couldn't use the Stargate because it would cause an overload.
As an overview, I thought this was a good episode, but it suffers from too many inconsistencies.
Posted by: ted_simple Dec 8th 2005, 6:47 AM
Another point:
It also seemed odd that the scanners on the Daedalus didn't detect the Goa'uld earlier. They have an Asgard onboard, and we know from SG-1's 5x22 "Revelations" that they can scan for symbiotes. First off there should have been a routine scan when the ship was boarded (on earth), and of course when they KNEW there was a intruder why didn't the Asgard scan for a Goa'uld. Maybe Caldwell sabotaged the scanners also. But then they should have scanned him on Atlantis. Perhaps they had their hands so full that they didn't think of scanning for symbiotes; although they would have been kind of neglegent if they didn't scan the interviewed people such as Cananaugh.
Another point:
You would also expect the Wraith are a bit more thorough. The transmitter on the shore should have aroused suspicion. Why not blow the planet to pieces. Or leave a cruiser there to patrol so that Atlantis must remain cloaked all the time. Or just an observation satellite. Besides when they first did the cloak trick in The Siege I couldn't believe the Wraith wouldn't even fire at the position where Atlantis was previously - just to make sure it was gone.
Teyla singing.
Cadmin and Rodney.
Posted by: Raxor Dec 8th 2005, 11:53 AM
maybe they didnt think to check for symbiotes because the goauld are considered much less of a threat, or all they recources were on other things maybe?
Posted by: hobo_joe20 Dec 8th 2005, 12:42 PM
I'm pretty sure they mentioned the trust ..... and everyone knows the Goa'uld made up the trust. It should have been the first thing they did ... unless Caldwell was in charge of that I guess.
Posted by: ted_simple Dec 8th 2005, 2:01 PM
One more thing on the stupidity of the Wraith. They can surely scan for Naquadah, so they should realize the gate is gone (since it is cloaked away from sensors). But if they dial the gate they will realize that they get a lock. Surprise there, eh? Indication that something odd is going on? Nooooo....
I hate to say this but - as this episode has shown again - the Goa'uld were way cleverer baddies.
Posted by: Auntie Em! Dec 8th 2005, 5:57 PM
Why would the wraith scan for Naquadah. There is no natural occuring Naquadah in the Pegasus galaxy. The gate is not made of Naquadah.
Also there is no evidence that the Wraith even know of the address of Atlantis. Never once have they tried to dial the gate to Atlantis.
Posted by: Circe Dec 8th 2005, 10:53 PM
I was wondering why the info snippet from my Rodgers guide said McKay was to get a love interest and it never happened. Why did they change the show? I just went and read the spoiler and it sounds like the episode would have been better had they left it the way it said it was going to be in the spoiler. I would like to see someone other than Shep get the girl.
I would also like to just throw in once again that the Tayla singing bit was just dreadful
I hated it so much I have to say it twice.
Posted by: zpm Dec 9th 2005, 1:30 AM
I liked this ep Teyla singing was quite unexpected. The thing that got me was when Teyla tells Beckett not to help the dying women and hes like ive taken an oath to preserve life. Then she says you cannot interfere so he says ok and thats it didnt put up a fight at all.
Posted by: ted_simple Dec 9th 2005, 8:16 AM
Whatever stuff, they could scan for it. Prometheus does it all the time when they come to a planet in the milky way galaxy. If a ship like Prometheus can scan for a specific element, the Wraith should be able to do the same.
Right, the writers were clever enough not to scratch that topic. My point is the Wraith must be pretty stupid if they don't know the address; they've hunted Atlantis teams escaping through the gate many times, so they could remember the symbols flashing on the DHD (as most planets appear to have a DHD).
I see the problem that the two shows shouldn't get too similar, which would be boring; so the Wraith don't use typical Goa'uld tricks; the other side of the coin is that makes them look stupid because they disregard the obvious.
Posted by: ha'tak Dec 9th 2005, 5:51 PM
Well if you think they never really had to be sneaky and careful they're pretty much animals with intelligence all they think about is food. [they even fight eachother for it] they see themselves as stong and powerful compared to the people in Pegasus [locals not the Atlantians]. But we do see them being a little clever with the virus in the Daedalus
Posted by: Auntie Em! Dec 9th 2005, 8:47 PM
Ted I agree with you that a race that is space faring and as Ha'tak said can create a sophisticated virus does come off looking pretty dumb.
Posted by: Jack.go.marry.Sam! Dec 10th 2005, 2:43 AM
i think with wraith it is the same as with the goa'ulds, for a very long time they are the most powerful race in their galaxy (except for the ancients),just like the goauld were, it was always easy for them to fight again the 'primitive' ppl and they had their own way to do it..
now suddenly the ppl from earth come with new weapons and new fighting tacticts the wraith never saw before.. and they dont know what to do.. just like the goauld couldnt really handle the ppl from the sgc, it took them a while to adjust.. and i think it is the same with the wraith.. they will learn in time.. and we have to get better and better so we can defeat them..
i also think the wraith are very sure of themselves and very arrogant.. just like the goald were, i guess that all will change in later seasons
about the episode, i liked it.. it was really unexpected that the colonel was a goauld..
and i also like teylas singing :)
Posted by: alimakkaya Dec 10th 2005, 1:40 PM
Just had a chance to watch the new episode. Actualy I was not aware that the second half of the season started airing .
Loved the singing part of Taila, the show surely needs more :} . About the thing the Wraith being dumb, they never looked smart to me. The problem is they won every battle by their wast numbers, not because they were clever, and in fact wraith is most probably not the creators of the virus. As wraith are also evolved from bugs and human beings and coexisted with ancients, adopted their technolgy, they actually got everything from anciens, I do not think they are capable of such advanced tech. I thought Ori did created the virus that viped out ancients.. whatever.. nice episode.. And we love Teila, stop comparing Ronin with her :) .
Posted by: Auntie Em! Dec 10th 2005, 8:40 PM
The Orii did create the virus that wiped out the ancients. The virus we are talking about is the virus that the wraith that installed in the Daedalus mainframe.
Posted by: Evil Wraith Dec 10th 2005, 10:54 PM
I dont think we should be that harsh with Cavanough, he was anoying and didnt have any friends in Atlantis but he did came up with the idea that saved Shepard and Teyla in "38 minutes"............. cut him some slack
Posted by: Jack.go.marry.Sam! Dec 11th 2005, 1:15 AM
was it actually said in an atlantis episode that the wraith use the technology of the ancients for themselves?
i thought they advanced so far on their own..
Posted by: ha'tak Dec 11th 2005, 2:02 AM
well from what we know of the Wraith they were origionally a form of the Euratus Bug [38 Minutes] which then got some of the ancient DNA in their own creating a new hybrid species The Wraith
over time they increased in thier Population and based their Tech off of the Ancients [simlar to the Goa'uld who's tech is never completely origional]. The Ancients had underestimated their threat untill it was too late and couldnt solve the problem indoing so leading to thier fall
Posted by: Ilzy Dec 11th 2005, 3:53 PM
Don't know why so many of you didn't like the Tayla singing part (and nobody will make me believe that it was actually she who singed! ) IMO the whole combination of scenes with music was really well done!
All in all I really liked this episode. Good thing is that it was really unpredictable - who would have thought that colonel "X-files" will be a goa'uld?
And guess why the red-haired bomb expert asked to stay a little longer?
Posted by: Auntie Em! Dec 11th 2005, 10:02 PM
It was her singing. Some of the actors were doing a commentary for a season 1 dvd episode and they talked about how Teyla just finished singing in an upcoming S2 episode. This has to the that episode.
I think it was awesome.
Why did Cadman want to stay longer? Actually there was suppose to be a love story in this episode between her and Rodney but I guess the episode ran over and they axed it.
Posted by: Ilzy Dec 12th 2005, 12:16 AM
With Rodney?
The girl was all over dr. Beckett!
Posted by: Auntie Em! Dec 12th 2005, 1:30 AM
To make Rodney jealous. Though, now I am questioning myself. I am pretty sure it was suppose to be Rodney.
Posted by: rkenshin Dec 12th 2005, 2:03 PM
) IMO the whole combination of scenes with music was really well done!All in all I really liked this episode. Good thing is that it was really unpredictable - who would have thought that colonel "X-files" will be a goa'uld?
And guess why the red-haired bomb expert asked to stay a little longer?
Rachel was credited for the singing of "Beyond the Night" in the credits.. Guess nobody watches those anymore :P
Posted by: ha'tak Dec 12th 2005, 10:45 PM
I watched the commentary that Auntie watched and it confirms it as well
and for Cadman's love intrest didnt in the EP Beckett mention something about a date with her or someting or another [yet again it might be my mind playing tricks again ]
Posted by: Mattthegreat995 Dec 13th 2005, 2:23 AM
Woah. Caldwell a Goau'ld (Cant spell it). Did NOT see that comin...
Ronon was funny: What's a Goa'uld. hehe
Cadmin. HAWT!
Zelenka at the end.
Dr. Lee's LOTR comment
Some SGC action! No SG1 was dissapointing though...
JUst the whole ep.
Posted by: Ilzy Dec 14th 2005, 12:25 AM
As far as I remember in Gemini she wanted to have a date with Beckett (remember the Rondey - Beckett kiss?
) and in the end of this episode she and Beckett were about to go somewhere before McKay showwed up so I was pretty sure that those two have something between them.
Posted by: Sibylle Dec 14th 2005, 11:58 AM
I think it is a bit stupid that the ZPM is able of overloading itself in such a short notice of time....
It holds the power to keep the WHOLE GIGANTIC CITY shielded for several weeks/months while allmost all of the wraith ships are firing at full power!!!!! WTF, kewl!!
But again, when it is asked to dial the gate to earth is will use somuch power it is needed to be controlled ... ?????? stupid i think.....the amount of power used is just to few, why would it drain extra power?????
Posted by: hobo_joe20 Dec 14th 2005, 12:02 PM
It holds the power to keep the WHOLE GIGANTIC CITY shielded for several weeks/months while allmost all of the wraith ships are firing at full power!!!!! WTF, kewl!!
But again, when it is asked to dial the gate to earth is will use somuch power it is needed to be controlled ... ?????? stupid i think.....the amount of power used is just to few, why would it drain extra power?????
Earth is in a Galaxy far, far away. It required many much power to dial even another planet in your solar system. So many much more power is needed to dial earth from Pegasus. Far less than it requires to power the shields.
Posted by: Sibylle Dec 14th 2005, 12:25 PM
I dont think so, rewatch the episode again.......the asgard shields on Deadulus are not able to hold many shots from a wraith ship, cruiser or hive....
But the shields of the ancients would hold the shields for weeks again FULL wraith weapon power!!!!!!
And even if dialing the gate requires so much energy, the zmp would be empty in short notice with all of those offworld activity's
But still my question is: the zpm can establish a wormhole to earth, and uses the power required for that, so why would it use so much more power without the 'dam'.........not necessary for creating/containing the wormhole isn't it?
Posted by: hobo_joe20 Dec 14th 2005, 4:03 PM
But the shields of the ancients would hold the shields for weeks again FULL wraith weapon power!!!!!!
And even if dialing the gate requires so much energy, the zmp would be empty in short notice with all of those offworld activity's
But still my question is: the zpm can establish a wormhole to earth, and uses the power required for that, so why would it use so much more power without the 'dam'.........not necessary for creating/containing the wormhole isn't it?
For the first part, the ancients had 3 ZPMs they were using to defend against the wraith shields. This provides many much more power than 1, especially when they are designed to power Ancient shields as opposed to Asgard ones.
as for the second part, not quite sure what you are talking about .....
Posted by: Atlantians Dec 17th 2005, 12:55 AM
I believe that a Intergalactic Stargate activation needs a powerfull initial burst of energy to activate. However only needs a fraction of that power to continue its activation. That is why we don't have enough energy to do that.
DHDs wouldn't have enough output to establish the initial wormhole, and probably would not have the power to maintain it anyway.
That would also explain why we can't simply use a capacitor to do it.
This would meen that a ZPM has a far greater output then any of our devicess.
Furthermore the ZPM is powering all of Atlantis, and it could probably power everything at once if it were not for the fact that they needed to limit its output to prevent it from overloading.
With three they did not have that problem.
But that raises the question: Why not have a bank of 10, 20 ZPMs not just 3?!
Edit-
New thought:Maybe the ZPM can regulate far more energy then what would cause the detonation in the episode without the failsafes, but the failsafe keeps it from jumping into actual overload?
Posted by: Carter-Hot Dec 19th 2005, 10:28 AM
This episode ROCKED!
It had everything - OMG, it was WOW!!!
It had tension, linkage, emotions, excitement - it was fantastic.
So far this episode reigns Season 2! (Not that "The Siege, Part 3" didn't). This episode was just perfect.
10/10!
Posted by: dr lee Dec 22nd 2005, 10:03 PM
just watched this episode and i agree with carter-hot, this episode rocked!
poor old zelenka stuck with those brats i had seen an image of beckett, zelenka, mackay and cadmin with zelenka cover in his 'warpaint' a few months ago and at the time i though 'when the hell was that taken?' and when i saw him i realised it was this one.
teyla's singing.... personally not my style but none the less it was good and helped create the tension at the end well.
caldwell as goa'uld? well i'd heard that this was the case a day b4 i saw the episode with my brothers and i was surpirsed to see the lack of hints that it could be him. when they beamed him into the room my bro turned to me and said 'it's him isn't it?' very good twist by TPTB.
the question i had after the episode was 'when and how was caldwell 'goa'ulded'?
Posted by: Pitry Dec 26th 2005, 5:11 AM
Yup, it was a good episode. I, too suspected Cadman (it was obvious it wasn't cavanagh tho, just because he is the obvious suspect).
Cavanagh tho leads me again to my usual rant about Atlantis and morality.
It's not that it bothers me if they take a moral stand that is opposed to mine. It's the fact they're unwilling to take it to the end. This entire "oh Cavanagh fainted before we had the time to torture him so all's alright" bit was an extremely cowardish get away from the problem they presented. I'm not even talking about the consistent stand SG1 always made concerning these issues.. it's the fact that to get whatever message they were trying to make, whether the end justifies the means or not, they should have taken it to the end, whatever they chose. Leaving it hanging there just nullefies the entire issue... and that's frustrating. For me, at least.
Oh, and I am rather pisse off tho with the consistent "by any means necessary" attitude that seems to be the Atlantis line. I thought Weir lost her tendency to do whatever Sheppard tells her back in Hot Zone?
Other than that (and, er, well, Teyla singing, but everyone's gonna know what I'll say about that, so.. ;)) it was a very cool episode. I totally didn't see the Coldwell as Goa'uld bit coming... heh. The Teyla story (minus ceremony) was also nice. Seems finally the writers want to give her a shred of personality ;) Zelenca was hilarious, so was the 101 Delmations\Lord of the Rings bit (I can so see the exact same thing happens when Binder\Wright were trying to explain it to the rest of the writers.. now it's only left to see who's the secret Delmations fan there :P) and all the SGC scenes - I knew Beau Bridges is in the episode but I was very surprised to see Barret, Dr Lee and Walter... huh. For a moment there I was watchign and then.. "er, what? Is this Atlantis?!" And I was thining I'd have to wait to January for new SG1 eps! :D
Posted by: Mister Oragahn Dec 26th 2005, 11:53 AM
It holds the power to keep the WHOLE GIGANTIC CITY shielded for several weeks/months while allmost all of the wraith ships are firing at full power!!!!! WTF, kewl!!
But again, when it is asked to dial the gate to earth is will use somuch power it is needed to be controlled ... ?????? stupid i think.....the amount of power used is just to few, why would it drain extra power?????
It's a problem.
That would explain why using 3 ZPMs at 33.3% is better than using one only at 100%.
Then we have to remember Siege Part III. McKay said that this ZPM would only hold for days, as less than weeks, so the higher limit is like, err, 13 days and several hours.
The trouble is that the idea wasn't that the ZPM would then overload, but that it would be depleted.
So we're stuck with stargates suddenly requiring huge amounts of energy, much more than what's necessary to withstand a constant orbital bombardment from 10 Wraith capships, while on the other hand we have cases where a mcgyvered simple liquid naqahdah cell enhanced with some fancy ancient tech can reach another far galaxy, much more distant than Pegasus.
And then, there's McKay who says that the ZPM overload would destroy the planet.
We're talking about the same ZPM which was used for an Earth-Pegasus long stargate connection, then used for a spacetrip between Earth and Atlantis, and then used for temporary protection against a fleet bombardment for several hours, and then used to provide energy to the whole city and feed the cloaking device.
And with all that energy sucked out, it can still destroy a planet.
I'm not sure things add up. It's not about the maximum level of energy a ZPM can release that I have problems with, but about the failsafe/overload mechanic and the difference of energy between an Erath-Atlantis stargate connection and a Wraith bombardment.
Either the stargate draws much more energy, in some unexplainable exponentional way (and even in contradiction with previous events - see SG-1 Fifth Race), or the Wraith are firing with watercannons.
Posted by: Pitry Jan 2nd 2006, 11:44 AM
Oh, yeah. Nitpick season.
Why oh why do you take out a Goa'uld with an Asgaard beam?! What's so wrong in flying Coldwell to the Tok'Ra?!
And don't "p3M" stars belong to Pegasus? I don't recall a single MW star that was designated with an "m". No, wait, there was one in season 2. ;)
Posted by: Auntie Em! Jan 2nd 2006, 2:31 PM
Pitry you know I love ya right but WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT!
What is a P3m star?
Posted by: Pitry Jan 4th 2006, 1:07 PM
LoL, Em, sorry!
The designation of differnet stargates. In Atlantis it's always "P3M - " then three numbers. SG! usually gets "P3X-" then three numbers.
In the SGC debriefing, Dr Lee suggests sending a team to a planet in the MY designated by "P3M - "three numbers, like the Atlantis ones.
I'm a horrible nitpicker, meknows.
Posted by: Auntie Em! Jan 6th 2006, 8:23 AM
OH DOH to me Pitry! Now I understand. Sorry love!
Posted by: Droncha Jan 9th 2006, 1:09 PM
Hey, I see that I'm not the only one who liked Teyla's singing. Maybe someone knows where to get her song in mp3? I did think about taking it from the episode itself, but it is mized with other sounds, so that wouldn't be pretty!
Can anyone help me out?
Posted by: linda_lol Jan 14th 2006, 7:56 PM
This episode was bleh, I didn't like it. Shepard was funny, and it was kinda sad at the end because I actually had an urge for him to go with the Ancient, though, overall, I liked last weeks better.
I'll give it a 7.
Posted by: Acaurie Jan 20th 2006, 10:29 PM
Any idea where I can get that song? That was fantastic...She has a beautiful voice!!!
Posted by: danielfan Jan 20th 2006, 10:45 PM
I think the different letters represent the environment of the planet/moon
Posted by: Lisa Jan 21st 2006, 1:27 AM
Okay. So basically, I thought that the plot of this episode was roughly strung together. Or at least felt that way. This is how I saw the episode.
"Landry...there's a bomb!"
SGC: *GASP* WE NEED TO TELL ATLANTIS!
Lee: Random LOTR thing which was hilarious.
SGA: *Recieves message* There's a bomb. But not really a bomb. It's a...GOA'ULD!
Everyone: *Gasps*
SGA: Random tension. And funny exchange of dialogue between Shepard and Ronan.
Turns out Colonel Codwell is a GOA'ULD! When the heck did that happen?
End of Episode.
*Shrug* Oh well. I still watched it.
Mainly because of the "Midnight bark" comment and
Shepard: What'd you do to him?
Ronan: Nothing. He passed out before I could touch him.
Posted by: linda_lol Jan 21st 2006, 1:29 AM
I'll give it a 7.
I feel like an idiot right now because I actually posted in the wrong topic. Idiot me.
Well, I guess I'll reply now.
I absolutely loved this episode, the music at the end was beautiful! What surprised me was the very end with who it would be. Throughout the episode I was trying to point out certain subjects and wondering how Weir could possibly be the suspect, which, I later found out was that the commercial tricked us. Anyway, whoa, that Colonel. He was the last guy on my list.
Hhhhmmmm.... I can't wait to see what he has to say with the snake out of his head.
Was that Teyla's or someone lip syncing?
Posted by: jjpywakit Jan 21st 2006, 3:08 AM
Cavanough.... me thinks he is an ass. I love when the Asgard look up and tells him to "stop talking please. Thank you."
I almost peed my pants when they were just about to push the engage button to earth and McKay yells. "STOP". I got chills all over. Oh my when the gate started to dial itself without the ZPM I was oh my goodness. The NID are nasty asses. Sneaky.
I loved seeing the SGC in the episodes. Not for a few seconds either but quite a bit there.
I thought that Cadmin was the one who planeted the bomb but when I saw Cavaungh I thought imediately that it was that slimy ass kissing moron of a man. What is with Cadmin suddenly being an explosive expert? :blink: It was suspicious that Cavanagh kept coming and going from Atlantis. Begging to come back to Atlanis after he begged to leave after "The Siege" only to stay for 3 weeks before begging to leave again. The guy is an ass. What was in those encryptic messages he did send. He may not have planeted the failsafe code in the end but something is pretty fishy with him. He is a wimp for passing out also. *Shivers* I cannot stand him.
Lots of good Big D shots. Love that they used them to relay the messages back and forth. Funny how the Big D left back for Atlantis without permission.
This was a very good Teyla episode. Why so many hate her I do not understand. The Ring ceramony, it was beautiful. Teyla singing. WOW. Galic in nature. It was awesome. Great to get a Telya story.
No bomb? Just screwing with the power flow regulators? The goa'uld rewrote the program surrrounding the ZPM securing it with a failsafe code. I was like what about the captain of the Big D. Caldwell. How come no one suspected him. As I said I got suspicious when the Big D turned to come back to Atlantis leaving the SGC in the lurch. When they beamed him out I knew it. When his eyes glowed I was like HOLEY sh*t! Smart move with the tazer gun as that has been well established in Stargate SG-1. I loved the interplay bewteen the ceramony and hightening tension of a impending wraith attack.
Zelinka :laugh: How funny was he in all those little pigtails. How pissed at McKay was he! Nice that McKay did not save the day but rather a junior character.
This episode was stupid as all hell! Especially the Teyla singing thing!!! Freakin dumb! The worst SG Atlantis episode so far! One of the main things that makes this show good is the funny dialogues between characters - (looks like a door! - yes it is amazingly door-like isn't it") - where was it? Very choppy progression culminating in that stupid singing scene - I was very dissappointed with this episode - not up to par with the last one at all! Goauld in Caldwell - so what....Goaulds have been in so many SG members its not a big deal nor a big surprise!
I was wondering why the info snippet from my Rodgers guide said McKay was to get a love interest and it never happened. Why did they change the show? I just went and read the spoiler and it sounds like the episode would have been better had they left it the way it said it was going to be in the spoiler. I would like to see someone other than Shep get the girl.
I would also like to just throw in once again that the Tayla singing bit was just dreadful :sick: I hated it so much I have to say it twice. :sick:
Thank you! I totally agree - The Teyla singing thing was way over the top in the stupid category!
Posted by: Trudi~ Jan 21st 2006, 8:39 AM
The Teyla singing was beautiful. I loved how they kept the music going, as they showed everyone else. How can you say that it was dumb? It shows a different side to Teyla I think. As far as the Goauld, I was surprised that it was in Caldwell, and happy because then Ronon got to beat him up! The LOTR joke was great, along with many other things in this episode. One of the best of the second season so far. 10/10
Posted by: Ziu Jan 21st 2006, 9:11 AM
I liked this episode a lot. I definitely was a surprise who the Goa'uld was.
Looks like all folks need to be screened for being a Goa'uld. Hopefully better than Airport Security. 
Posted by: startreksuite Jan 21st 2006, 10:46 AM
Intense episode! I'm sure certain members won't be happy with the murder mystery aspect of this show! I also was on the edge of my seat when Rodney yelled "Stop!" when the tech had his hand hovering over the last symbol! I was so sure Kavanaugh did it, since he was so shady, and didn't like anything that was going on! Colonel Caldwell as Gou'ld? A shocker! But considering that the other former X-Files characters were questionable (Spender as a reporter ready to let out the Stargate secret, the Cigarette Smoking Man as an Orii), I should have figured it out. I loved Teyla's singing, the song in general was cool. Does anyone know if that was really her? I think if she had an album I'd buy it! Rodney was genius as well, keeping the ZPM from activating as long as possible! I am truly surprised that Ronan took Caldwell out as soon as he did, without Caldwell throwing so much as a punch! Hmmm.... And John just shot him with a tazer, and got him to confess? I think that scene could have been more developed! Oh well, great episode over all
Posted by: rob117 Jan 21st 2006, 11:05 AM
Really great episode. In fact all three shows had really great episodes this Friday.
I actually like that they're beginning to cross over between SG1 and Atlantis more often. It's very important to make sure that these shows continue to take place in the same reality as each other.
Show of hands for a confrontation between the Wraith, the Goa'uld, and the Ori...
Posted by: Ilzy Jan 21st 2006, 11:11 AM
I loved Teyla's singing, the song in general was cool. Does anyone know if that was really her? I think if she had an album I'd buy it!
Yup, it was really her! Wouldn't have believed it if I wasn't told otherwise
Posted by: Austin Jan 21st 2006, 11:29 AM
I watched the commentary that Auntie watched and it confirms it as well
She may have recorded the song in a studio but she was definitely lipsynching, not doubt about that.
The song could've been fantastic but this is why i wanted to shoot myself throughout the whole ending...
(I should say, I was more amused than terrified of the song, and laughed uncontrollably)
The song coulve been wonderful if it weren't for the fact that there was an orchestra in the background and her voice wasn't so synthesized. In my opinion, the same effect of panning to the rest of the team to show threir struggles during Teyla's song wouldve been much more affective if they wouldve made the song scene as such:
Did anyone find it awkward that none of the other villagers were humming or playing instruments or anything...they just stood there are Teyla broke into song backed by a full tiered orchestra? I think if they wouldve had the villagers playing the instruments and Teyla faltering throughout the song, seeing as she would clearly be upset and contemplating the words she was singing, the whole thing wouldv'e been acceptable...It makes it look more spontaneous and realistic. Watching Teyla sing was like watchign Pippin sing at the end of LOTR 2....minus every single bit of elegance of that song.
The whole thing was just awkward.
Posted by: Saffron Jan 21st 2006, 12:01 PM
OK...Rachel has a lovely voice and it was a beautiful song. I just don't think it fit in with the rest of the epi. I think it would have worked better with another storyline. To me, the two storylines just didn't mesh.
Posted by: danielfan Jan 21st 2006, 12:28 PM
I actually like that they're beginning to cross over between SG1 and Atlantis more often. It's very important to make sure that these shows continue to take place in the same reality as each other.
I agree. I know some don't like it, but it would be wrong to ignore the connection.
I just keep wondering who else from Xfiles they will bring in. I assume since Xfiles was filmed in Vancouver, that many of them live there/near there. That must at least explain part of why we keep seeing Xfile actors in both SG series.
Loved the LOTR/Dalmatians line...... except I thought oh man he has kids.
Posted by: Lisa Jan 21st 2006, 2:16 PM
Loved the LOTR/Dalmatians line...... except I thought oh man he has kids.
Hahahahaha.
That is the SAME thing I thought.
And then I wondered how many times had he watched 101 Dalmatians to refer to something at the government run SGC...as the "Twilight Bark" *Sigh* His kids might be a bit more flaberghasted-like than him.
Posted by: StillLoveJeffWebber Jan 21st 2006, 2:32 PM
I'm in NW CT and for some reason my DirectTV Tivo recorded SG:1 and Battlestar but not Atlantis....
It didn't even record the usual late night repeat.
Any thoughts?
Most annoying (This happened with NCIS the week beofre last as well.)
Posted by: rob117 Jan 21st 2006, 5:39 PM
I'm in NW CT and for some reason my DirectTV Tivo recorded SG:1 and Battlestar but not Atlantis....
It didn't even record the usual late night repeat.
Any thoughts?
Most annoying (This happened with NCIS the week beofre last as well.)
That happened to me last week, but I was able to catch the repeats.
I think what's happening is that the DVR thinks it's a repeat, even if it's new. If you press the info button for it, it has the date as 2005. If you set it to record both repeats and first runs (instead of first runs only), it should tape it.
Posted by: dr lee Jan 21st 2006, 5:57 PM
http://www.gateworld.net/news/2006/01/tivonoticeiatlantisiseason.shtml
that might help in working out whats happened.
Posted by: IndyJan Jan 21st 2006, 8:39 PM
This was a good episode. Can I say how much I detest Kavanaugh!!!! It was quite obvious that they were trying to make him the one. Consequently, it wouldn't be him. But can we just ship him home and forget about him.
Then McKay mentioned Cadman, and I thought, nah, not her.
When they showed Caldwell, I turned to my hubby and said, "I wonder if it could be him." I had not heard how long MP would be on the show. Caldwell has been a hard-ass at times. Definitely pro military, much like the NID. Yet, he also comes through for them. So I wasn't surprised by it being him. I have to say, I was glad how they did it, because they can now keep Caldwell around.
We got a Teyla background story, but once again, BORING! It did nothing for me.
Poor Zelenka, what did those kids do to him? 
Edit: regarding Teyla's singing, I got to read the words because I watch in CC. The words were fine, but the story along with the song didn't do anything, like I said. It was boring. It was quite obvious that she was not singing live, but lipsynching.
Posted by: ZeroPoint Jan 21st 2006, 8:59 PM
I'd review the episode, but thought of this after erasing mine.
Was it mentioned about how far back Caldwell probably got the symbiote?
Hope it was quite recent, since otherwise, all of Caldwell's attitude would have been Goauld and not himself.
It'd quite annoy me to find out to find that he was a generous and caring and nice person, but it was only the symbiote that made him abrasive.
Posted by: IndyJan Jan 21st 2006, 11:10 PM
I'd review the episode, but thought of this after erasing mine.
Was it mentioned about how far back Caldwell probably got the symbiote?
Hope it was quite recent, since otherwise, all of Caldwell's attitude would have been Goauld and not himself.
It'd quite annoy me to find out to find that he was a generous and caring and nice person, but it was only the symbiote that made him abrasive.
The only thing mentioned was that it had happened recently. So I'm assuming it happened his last visit back to earth. Caldwell a caring, generous and nice person? Who have you been watching? That has never been Caldwell's character. He has been a bad-ass, take no charge military person. He has wanted to take over Atlantis and run it himself. He has gone head to head with Weir. I will say that he has come through when the team needed him to say the day at times, but that's all.
Posted by: Falcon One Jan 21st 2006, 11:15 PM
Fantastic episode, the BEST ONE this year.
If you look harder, they were playing instruments.
Posted by: puseyuk Jan 22nd 2006, 1:26 PM
That happened to me last week, but I was able to catch the repeats.
I think what's happening is that the DVR thinks it's a repeat, even if it's new. If you press the info button for it, it has the date as 2005. If you set it to record both repeats and first runs (instead of first runs only), it should tape it.
Any with a shows as important as SG-1 and Atlantis, do you really want your trust your DVR and let I do it all by itself. I certianly wouldn't and in fact i don't. I do all mine manually.
Posted by: Ilzy Jan 22nd 2006, 1:47 PM
The only thing mentioned was that it had happened recently. So I'm assuming it happened his last visit back to earth. Caldwell a caring, generous and nice person? Who have you been watching? That has never been Caldwell's character. He has been a bad-ass, take no charge military person. He has wanted to take over Atlantis and run it himself. He has gone head to head with Weir. I will say that he has come through when the team needed him to say the day at times, but that's all.
He's not that bad IMO. He's just the tough military guy with the 'shoot first' attitude, he always sees the worst case scenario and is ready to do anything to minimalise the threats. If I were on his side in a battle I'd feel pretty safe and certain that he'd be the man to protect his people.
Actually he reminds me of O'Neil in the Stargate movie just without the suicidal tendency. I can understand why he doesn't like the way Weir (a civilian for crying out loud!) runs Atlantis - it often seems that she's not decisive enough and thinks first about moral and only then about safety (I'm exaggerating a little but you get the idea).
Posted by: ZeroPoint Jan 22nd 2006, 6:07 PM
The only thing mentioned was that it had happened recently. So I'm assuming it happened his last visit back to earth. Caldwell a caring, generous and nice person? Who have you been watching? That has never been Caldwell's character. He has been a bad-ass, take no charge military person. He has wanted to take over Atlantis and run it himself. He has gone head to head with Weir. I will say that he has come through when the team needed him to say the day at times, but that's all.
I think you missed my point, Indy. IF the symbiote was introduced to Caldwell a year ago (before he met the Atlantis team), we would have no idea what his non-symbiote personality would be. He could've been Mr. Happy until the symbiote and we've just been seeing the symbiote personality all the while.
Posted by: IndyJan Jan 22nd 2006, 10:42 PM
He's not that bad IMO. He's just the tough military guy with the 'shoot first' attitude, he always sees the worst case scenario and is ready to do anything to minimalise the threats. If I were on his side in a battle I'd feel pretty safe and certain that he'd be the man to protect his people.
Actually he reminds me of O'Neil in the Stargate movie just without the suicidal tendency. I can understand why he doesn't like the way Weir (a civilian for crying out loud!) runs Atlantis - it often seems that she's not decisive enough and thinks first about moral and only then about safety (I'm exaggerating a little but you get the idea).
Don't get me wrong, Caldwell is who I would want on my side also. He is a take charge kind of guy. He wants the military in charge, right or wrong. I don't always agree with him, but he definitely is the type to have at your back.
I think you missed my point, Indy. IF the symbiote was introduced to Caldwell a year ago (before he met the Atlantis team), we would have no idea what his non-symbiote personality would be. He could've been Mr. Happy until the symbiote and we've just been seeing the symbiote personality all the while.
Okay, my bad, I misunderstood what you were saying. I thought you were describing the Caldwell we have been seeing. But I doubt very much if his personality could have been Mr. Happy! I don't think he could have gotten that far in the military with that attitude.
Posted by: Cathara Jan 23rd 2006, 2:38 PM
Enjoyed the episode very much! Plenty of twists and turns and the humor that I enjoy so much about this show was definitely there.
The whole Teyla singing thing...
Yes it was a very pretty song, and she looked beautiful singing it, and her voice was great. The problem for me was that a musical number - however somber - is totally out in left field for what I expect from a show like Atlantis.
I'm all for giving new things a chance, but it seemed so abrupt. One minute they are gathering for a funeral rite - the next there is a full orchestra of Celtic music playing over a montage of events.
I think it was that full orchestra of instruments that was way too over the top for me. If they had let Teyla sing alone, perhaps accompanied only by someone on a simple flute or whistle instrument, someone you could see standing in the circle around the deceased lady...
Everything else could have been left the same, the montage was effective and the imagery of the funeral rite itself was gorgeous.
But as it was...My hubby started laughing at the screen - I just felt embarressed. Oh well...it was a beautiful song! 
Posted by: Ziu Jan 23rd 2006, 3:02 PM
Enjoyed the episode very much! Plenty of twists and turns and the humor that I enjoy so much about this show was definitely there.
The whole Teyla singing thing...
Yes it was a very pretty song, and she looked beautiful singing it, and her voice was great. The problem for me was that a musical number - however somber - is totally out in left field for what I expect from a show like Atlantis.
I'm all for giving new things a chance, but it seemed so abrupt. One minute they are gathering for a funeral rite - the next there is a full orchestra of Celtic music playing over a montage of events.
I think it was that full orchestra of instruments that was way too over the top for me. If they had let Teyla sing alone, perhaps accompanied only by someone on a simple flute or whistle instrument, someone you could see standing in the circle around the deceased lady...
Everything else could have been left the same, the montage was effective and the imagery of the funeral rite itself was gorgeous.
But as it was...My hubby started laughing at the screen - I just felt embarressed. Oh well...it was a beautiful song!
I wasn't laughing, but getting angry. Yes, it was a beautiful song, but it had no business being in this particular episode. I really liked this storyline until Teyla's portion was introduced.
Posted by: MYOB Jan 23rd 2006, 8:36 PM
I'm of agreement that Caldwell's melding was recent and not long term otherwise he would have been spending a lot more time trying to access Ancient technology and that might have caused some suspicion. Not that he was a snakehead but that he might have been in the trust.
Then again not many people in Atlantis would be very aware of the trust and not recognize the problem. More than likey this was a situation very similar to what happened to Senator/VP Kinsey last year. They grabbed him and implanted him on the spot.
I didn't take their reason why the trust would do this either.
The goul'd are on the run. Their base of power is gone. They have no army other than of themselves and other goul'd and that probably means infighting at some point. They have no fleet other than a few scant ships here or there that they managed to either hide or get ahold of since last year. They might have managed some things but for the most part the issue is that they have far worse to fear in the now rather than worry about the Wraith who I'm afraid are not nearly an issue in our galaxy or ever will be. The Ori are a much, much, much greater threat and the Wraith are nothing in comparison. The sum forces of those intelligent space faring races in this galaxy could easily defend against a wraith invasion.
So why would the goul'd within the trust really concern themselves so much with what they know is a cat out of the bag situation? The wraith already know we're here. They just can't cross the span between galaxies to get to us. But they know where we are.
In fact I would have surmised that for the Wraith to think there was no other life in the other galaxies they would have to be dumber than the goul'd.
I'll go even farther and say that the wraith are an even weaker opponent than the goul'd by far and wide. I don't really consider the wraith that much of a threat to Atlantis, and that's not based on my knowing that the good guys win on these tv shows but instead is based on the fact they've been outsmarted and outfoxed at every angle so far.
The only impressive thing they've done so far was in the finale last year and detonate the mined nukes by sending astroids into their path.
The more I watch the wraith the more I am amazed that the ancients lost to these creatures cause I can't for the life of me think the wraith had anything more than numbers on their side and that should not have been enough considering the technology advantage the ancients had.
But overall it was a good episode. I was totally caught off guard about Caldwell being the goul'd. I also didn't expect him to be a goul'd at all but just a spy of some kind. A member of a militant pro-earth faction of some sort that wants to destroy any threats to the planet by any means necessary, including destroying Atlantis so that it doesn't allow the wraith to get to our galaxy.
Posted by: Salmek101 Jan 25th 2006, 11:45 AM
I thought the singing part at the end by Teyla fit cause it a tense situation where the wraith were about to get to the city and they were trying to find who the goauld was! I thought she sang good and the overall of the episode was awsome! The best it has ever had this season i think!
Posted by: Dafmeister Jan 25th 2006, 4:06 PM
I thought this was a good epsiode, one of the best of season 2. Hermiod telling Cavenaugh to stop talking was the best part, followed by Zelenka after he returned to Atlantis.
Teyla's song seemed out of place but I think it was a good addition to the episode (obviously she was lip synching but was it really her voice?).
EDIT: Did anyone else notice that when Dr Lee was drawing on the board he used Earth's point of origin as the symbol for Atlantis? Earth was just a circle with an "E" in it.
On a side note, Leiutenant Cadman...wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. Dare I say that she is a hottie? Yes, I dare.
Posted by: Parmenides Jan 25th 2006, 4:33 PM
Yes, yes you do dare! I dare too!
I noticed about Lee using Earth's PoO to represent Atlantis, which was just weird...surely it should be reserved only for references to Earth itself?
I really liked all of the minor characters that featured this week that we hadn't seen for a while, like Cadman, Hermiod and Hiccup-lady...and I suppose Cavanaugh!
Liked the tense scenes, as in a rare occurence they were actually tense!
Didn't see Caldwell coming, though as soon as he was beamed down it was obvious...which was the point, I assume. I was trying to decide between it really being Cavanaugh or if it was Cadman, but Caldwell didn't cross my mind. I was particularly pleased with this unpredictable ending!
I would've liked it if Cavanaugh had actually been beat up during the interrogation...not just because I hate him so, but because of the moral and ethical implications that would arise, especially when it turned out not to be him. To have him faint at the last minute just seemed like a cop-out. Boohoo, Weir gets upset at the line that she'd cross, but it would've been more powerful if she had to actually deal with the consequences.
Teyla's story was touching, but seemed completely disjointed from the rest of the episode. We saw real emotion in Teyla, which was a nice change. I've always liked Teyla, and this type of thing is just another reason why. I liked the song, but I do agree, there was something weird about it.
The Wraith were the B-story!
Posted by: JC1 Jan 25th 2006, 4:36 PM
Definately, one of better episodes this season. Although, I really could have done without Teyla singing and I felt her story just got in the way of the main the story.
I didn't think the Goa'uld was Kavanaugh or Cadmen, but I didn't think it was Caldwell either. He didn't seem to be acting any different than usual. So I wonder how long he was a Goa'uld, and if he was working for 'The Trust' before he became one.
Not sure why the Goa'uld are worried about the Wraith any way. They don't represent much of threat to the Milky Way galaxy.
Still, an enjoyable episode, with some nice cross-over to the SG1 galaxy.
Posted by: glom Jan 25th 2006, 4:39 PM
51% It's not like there's an excess of good material this season. They could have fleshed out these stories into a couple of episodes worth. Maybe then, it would have been better.
TREKKISM OF THE WEEK: It's called a fuse, people!
TREKKISM OF THE WEEK RUNNER-UP: So it seems Atlantis has some big ass operating system. Obviously it's run by the same Big Brother computers that have caused the demise of so many Starfleet ships due to their fundamental flaw of total centralisation.
MYSTERY OF THE WEEK: Why exactly did the Goa'uld want to blow up Atlantis?
AIR FORCE UNINTELLIGENCE OF THE WEEK: Just how long was the captain of the most powerful vehicle ever built by the Tau'ri? At a time when it is known Goa'uld have infiltrated high level government, shouldn't the proper exams being a requisite? He must have been taken as a host while on Earth, so why wasn't he checked before reboarding the Daedalus?
TRUST UNINTELLIGENCE/UNNECESSARILY SLOW DIPPING MECHANISM OF THE WEEK: If this Trust sabotage had been more intelligently thought through, then as soon as Caldwell had gone to hyperspace, the program would have immediately activated the stargate, the stardrive, the shield and finished the job there. Instead, we have the usual painfully slow routine of gradually ramping up the jeopardy in order to give the heroes time to jerry-rig a solution.
TRUST SUPERINTELLIGENCE OF THE WEEK: Sure they're Goa'uld, but being able to rewrite the operating system of The Greatest City Ever Built is a stretch.
CONTRIVANCE OF THE WEEK: This plan must have been in the works a long time. Isn't it fortunate that the NID broke it just hours before it was about to reach the endgame?
MORAL AMBIGUITY OF THE WEEK: Beckett declares that he will not standby and allow a patient to die, when he could prevent. Then he pauses and decides he will. Given the simplicity of that, I fail to see why there was so much fuss with Terry Schiavo.
WHITEWASH OF THE WEEK: So Kavannah fainted before Ronan could touch him? How lucky! Now we can get away with some quiet musings from Weir over the fact she, hippie-in-chief, ordered a prisoner to be tortured for information she didn't even know he possessed. By turning it into a bit of slapstick, we completely whitewash over this darkness. Was this story conceived by the same Brad Wright who wrote 'The Other Side' or has Wright been possessed since by a Goa'uld?
HIPPIE OF THE WEEK: Well it sure wasn't Weir, that's for sure. But I thought we were about to hear 'Age of Aquarius' when the song started. It was a nice song, but this was hardly the time for it.
AIRBUS COMMONALITY OF THE WEEK: Well it seems that cross-continuity is a common thread of both episodes this week. This obviously looks very good from one angle. It makes the two series look more like variants of a larger, grander epic, than just two individual series with a common setting, much like the A330 and A340 are essentially variants of the same family. The downside is that when the particular thread is not something you want in one series, it is rubbing salt in the wound to put it in the other. The Trust might just be one of those threads.
CHEESE OF THE WEEK: "Oh my god! The Trust have planted a bomb on Atlantis! We're in BIIIG trouble!" Man that teaser was cheesy.
Posted by: ali Jan 26th 2006, 12:15 PM
I really liked this ep..despite the slightly cheesy singing bit. It was nice and everything, but I was on the point of cringing. A storyline like that should have been saved for another ep, because it couldn't really get enough foothold what with the rest of the stuff going on, and it just felt a bit superfluous. Rachel has a very nice voice though.
I was wondering when they were going to get round to a Goa'uld/Atlantis storyline. I liked the way they did that, with the Earth crossover. I kinda feel sorry for Kavanaugh..yet at the same time I really wanted Ronan to beat him up. Grrr! And I love the way everyone in the meeting suddenly perked up when Dr Lee mentioned LOTR...haha.
Posted by: ted_simple Feb 1st 2006, 4:25 AM
MYSTERY OF THE WEEK: Why exactly did the Goa'uld want to blow up Atlantis?
Because a ZPM explosion will destroy it irrecoverably so the Wraith will never obtain the intel where earth is.
One odd thing: Didn't the Daedalus need weeks for the trip without the ZPM? How comes they returned to Atlantis within hours, after they had already been so far away that they had contact with the Milky Way?
How convenient that the Asgard could modify the engines so easily... I'm not buying it!
Posted by: Dafmeister Feb 1st 2006, 11:26 AM
How convenient that the Asgard could modify the engines so easily... I'm not buying it!
They said that a team was sent to a planet on the edge of the Milky Way. They didnt say that the Daedalus was a huge distance from Atlantis, all they said was it was out of communication range. It is likely they were only a few days away from Atlantis and so modifying the engines allowed then to return in a matter of hours rather than days.
Posted by: blackbelt83 Feb 3rd 2006, 4:52 PM
I thought this was a good ep. I really thougth it was cool waching SG-1 and atlantis cross over I thought that was great the twilight bark I dint get it till he explaned it either but that was great everyone was looking at him blankly
Posted by: Auntie Em! Feb 12th 2006, 9:40 PM
I found a site that has the song with Teyla singing it.
http://85.17.2.4/dl/33cc23b471cedabb889af106744be950/43eff06e/sscuwm/Rachel_Luttrell_-_Beyond_the_Night.mp3
Posted by: startreksuite Feb 13th 2006, 7:40 AM
I found a site that has the song with Teyla singing it.
http://85.17.2.4/dl/33cc23b471cedabb889af106744be950/43eff06e/sscuwm/Rachel_Luttrell_-_Beyond_the_Night.mp3
Thanks Auntie Em! I wonder if there is more of her songs on the web!
Posted by: Auntie Em! Feb 13th 2006, 11:36 AM
This was found by Pegasus Angel. I do not think there are anymore. I think they only flew her to LA to record this one song. I quite like her singing.
Posted by: Aticus Mar 5th 2006, 10:19 PM
Wow wat a great episode. I didnt see the end coming. I thought for sure it was the ponytail guy since he had really suspiscious activity.
Posted by: AtheneBelle Apr 6th 2006, 7:42 AM
The song coulve been wonderful if it weren't for the fact that there was an orchestra in the background and her voice wasn't so synthesized. In my opinion, the same effect of panning to the rest of the team to show threir struggles during Teyla's song wouldve been much more affective if they wouldve made the song scene as such:
Did anyone find it awkward that none of the other villagers were humming or playing instruments or anything...they just stood there are Teyla broke into song backed by a full tiered orchestra? I think if they wouldve had the villagers playing the instruments and Teyla faltering throughout the song, seeing as she would clearly be upset and contemplating the words she was singing, the whole thing wouldv'e been acceptable...It makes it look more spontaneous and realistic. Watching Teyla sing was like watchign Pippin sing at the end of LOTR 2....minus every single bit of elegance of that song.
The whole thing was just awkward.
Now some have been complaining about that song but when I had heard it the first time I teared up.
I would agree with the part without the full orchestra. A flute, handrum, (not jsut used in Celtic music, it has been used in many cultures other than Gaelic so it's not far off the mark to include it) and guitar would have been just as effective. And was for her having a hitch in her voice (assuming she liked to sing a lot, but that's an assumption we don't know about) my father, sister and I all sang at my mother's funeral and we did not have a hitch in our voices. Some thought it was amazing that we were able to do it even then. For some music is a catharsis and in this instance Teyla's song definitely had that feeling.
I rewatched it recently with (slightly) less emotion and the music lent an atmosphere to what was going on all over Atlantis at that moment. I know some complained about it, butTake a moment and imagine that it had been a movie rather than a TV episode, would you have thought of the music in the same way?
Posted by: blackbelt83 Apr 16th 2006, 12:35 AM
One thing I don?t get is why dint they just do an MRI on everyone to find the gaould? Granted it would have took some time and they where on the clock. But I think they could have pulled it off. and was it just me or did Shepard seem a little to calm when he was talking about gaould?
Posted by: Cindy Apr 16th 2006, 2:26 AM
I thought this would have been a great episode if it had not been for all tht Tayla stuff. I hated the singing. I cringed and had to mute the TV. It was so stupid It ruined the entire episode!
How could you say that Teyla is a great singer and the whole song in the background when MaKay entered the access codes and when Caldwell was getting tortued. It just worked
Posted by: thefirstone Apr 16th 2006, 9:46 AM
One thing I don?t get is why dint they just do an MRI on everyone to find the gaould? Granted it would have took some time and they where on the clock. But I think they could have pulled it off. and was it just me or did Shepard seem a little to calm when he was talking about gaould?
Thats because hews never seen a goa'uld before that. I guess they didn't MRIs to check for goa'uld is because they didn't think they would encounter them and they would have been checked on Earth.
Posted by: Ancient Kane Jun 22nd 2006, 1:56 PM
No hes right that episode was ruined by the teyla story it would of been better if they had just cut that out and h 
ad some terminator music playing in the background.
Posted by: Dafmeister Jun 22nd 2006, 2:02 PM
No-one is right nor wrong. If some liked the Teyla story then it is fine and if others didn't like it then that too is fine. People who like the Teyla arc are not wrong.
People always have a different opinion of events in an episode and you cannot say they are wrong just because they happen to like something you do not.
Posted by: KillerMarv Jun 22nd 2006, 2:12 PM
Even if I don't like Teyla at all, even if I didn't like the Teyla story in this episode, I still enjoyed much the way she sings at the end. That song fits perfectly with the images that follow. Is it really her voice there? Because if it is, she's got wonderful singing talents.
Posted by: dr lee Aug 4th 2006, 7:57 AM
That was her voice at the end. If i'm correct she had to fly to LA and record her bit there before flying back to the set to film it.
Posted by: Pegasus Angel Aug 4th 2006, 2:20 PM
Well it was something different wasn't it, I thought so anyway. Added a bit of atmosphere to the ending.
Fair play to her for bothering to do something like that.
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