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Stargate Information Archive _ Atlantis Season 3 _ 312 - Echoes
Posted by: Arcady Nov 29th 2006, 8:14 PM
Season 3, Episode 12 - Echoes
Air date: March 2007
Dr. Beckett sees a medical crew operating on a badly burned man, but all of a sudden they are gone. Later, Rodney is working on a filter for understanding what whales are saying, and it turns out that they speak a known language.
http://www.sg1archive.com/atlantis/s3.shtml#312 | http://www.sg1archive.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=14751 | http://www.sg1archive.com/teasers/a312.html
(This topic is for people who have seen the episode to discuss it. If you don't want to be spoiled, don't read this topic.)
Posted by: Revan Nov 30th 2006, 2:06 PM
Excellent episode, great new special effects.
We have new establishing shots of the city, and I loved the shot of the Daedalus deflecting the coronal mass emission. The bow being torn up was nice.
The connection between the fish-whales and the hallucinations was obvious from the start, but I don't think it matters that much.
People bleeding out of their ears and stuff was getting a little gross.
Now we know what happens to the ZPM's... though hopefully this new one is fully charged, as opposed to half charged.
Posted by: magnavox Nov 30th 2006, 4:27 PM
I am so glad they didn't go down the path SG-1 did so many times and automatically assume one of their own is crazy just because something 'abnormal' happens.
Great character development (aww Shep carrying Weir, Ronan being there for Teyla 
) and McKay naming the whale Sam! 
And all the emails to Dr Weir
Was Hightmeyer always a red head? I thought she was blonde?
Posted by: Revan Nov 30th 2006, 4:47 PM
Was Hightmeyer always a red head? I thought she was blonde?
I am fairly certain she was a blonde... they seem to have changed her hair color... I do not think it looks good.
Posted by: hobo_joe20 Dec 1st 2006, 11:06 AM
I found this to be an excellent episode ..... up until the sun fired that beam of fire towards Atlantis. Here's my reasoning:
1/ That was a pretty thin beam (in terms of a galactic scale). So 1 happened 15 000 years ago (or whatever). The planet that Atlantis is on now will be in a different place than it was that long ago (chances are it wasn't to the day, so it would be in a different part of its orbit, not to mention we have no idea if its orbit has slowly been changing over the past few thousand years). If it has been like a "wave" (think round bracket shaped) aimed in atlantis's general direction then it would have been alittle more believeable.
2/ So because a nice, BIG, crecent shaped prominence collapses into the sun, a RAY is fired towards atlantis? Doesn't seem likely. See the end of 1 for my optimal shape.
3/ Sunspots are actually cooler than the surrounding sun surface by several thousand degrees ... so why would a hot beam of sun come out of a sunspot??
Posted by: Pitry Dec 2nd 2006, 4:46 PM
Seriously, if they keep on going in that raet, I'll run out of positive adjectives to describe SGA episodes.
Zelenca should wear more shirts liek that. He looked so lovely in the PJ! *shallow* very amusing moment there with Ronon and Sheppard and Zelenca. Now that's the kind of little character moments SGA needs.
So they actually can fit Teyla and Ronon into an episode! Hooray! There's hope for them yet...
I just loved Rodney and the whale. I half expected him to call it "Lassy" (sp? Y'know, the dog.) but I guess "Sam" works out as well, mwahaha. Entertainiend by Sheppard being creeped out by it. Overall Sheppard and McKay were lvoely in this episode! When they're checking for the lab, and Rodney doing all the handsigns.... Or in the infirmary, with the "Celine Dion is overrated! Zelenca is smarter than you!" ha!
Silly flashbacks/ warnings, I must admit, but it really was nice how it all tied up together.
So, SG1's now got 2 out of SGa's ZPMs. Wonder when they'll mention it, prolly in Line in the Sand?
Dominion speculations
I was surprised they had any money left whatsoever for visual effects in this episode, after the amazing sequences in The Return 2, but they were still great. Silly solution, and yet they were great. Both the sun and the whales. We should have more whale episodes.
Yup, definitely shippy vibes from Ronon and Teyla there.... sigh. I'mnot sure I'm happy with it, I'd have lived so much better without any ship whatsoever - especially not the John/Teyla/Ronon/Elizabeth hectagon they're creating.
Speaking of Elizabeth, loved her again in this episode. She's so lvoely So was Carson... who didn't have a large role in this but whatever he had he was lovely in.
The only thing I didn't like: Hightmeyer. She's getting on my nerves. Kill her! Now! please? Or no more psychologist episodes. Please please? Pretty please?
Other than that... fantabulous. I officially name Carl Binder a minor deity ;)
Posted by: Revan Dec 2nd 2006, 5:43 PM
Zelenca should wear more shirts liek that. He looked so lovely in the PJ! *shallow* very amusing moment there with Ronon and Sheppard and Zelenca. Now that's the kind of little character moments SGA needs.
So they actually can fit Teyla and Ronon into an episode! Hooray! There's hope for them yet...
I just loved Rodney and the whale. I half expected him to call it "Lassy" (sp? Y'know, the dog.) but I guess "Sam" works out as well, mwahaha. Entertainiend by Sheppard being creeped out by it. Overall Sheppard and McKay were lvoely in this episode! When they're checking for the lab, and Rodney doing all the handsigns.... Or in the infirmary, with the "Celine Dion is overrated! Zelenca is smarter than you!" ha!
I was surprised they had any money left whatsoever for visual effects in this episode, after the amazing sequences in The Return 2, but they were still great. Silly solution, and yet they were great. Both the sun and the whales. We should have more whale episodes.
Yup, definitely shippy vibes from Ronon and Teyla there.... sigh. I'mnot sure I'm happy with it, I'd have lived so much better without any ship whatsoever - especially not the John/Teyla/Ronon/Elizabeth hectagon they're creating.
I was also very pleased that Teyla and Ronon actually did something in this episode.
Why would Meredith name the whale-fish Lassy? I wasn't sure why Shep thought it was as creepy as he did....
I think that the stream of plasma was meant to fan out and become a sort of wave front...
What is a hectagon? Do you mean a parallelogram, perhaps a rhombus? I know of a 'hexagon'.... but that has six sides...
Posted by: hobo_joe20 Dec 2nd 2006, 9:46 PM
I think that the stream of plasma was meant to fan out and become a sort of wave front...
I think it was too ... but it wasn't at ALL noticible in this episode, seeming to be just a solid stream of fixed diameter. At the distance they were from the sun, if it were to fan out to be a respectable size when it hits atlantis (based on Atlantis's distance from the sun to support life, and the distance that the Deadalus would have to be from the sun to not be melted), that stream would have had to start out almost as small as a pin. I seriously doubt that ....
Posted by: Revan Dec 3rd 2006, 3:06 PM
I think it was too ... but it wasn't at ALL noticible in this episode, seeming to be just a solid stream of fixed diameter. At the distance they were from the sun, if it were to fan out to be a respectable size when it hits atlantis (based on Atlantis's distance from the sun to support life, and the distance that the Deadalus would have to be from the sun to not be melted), that stream would have had to start out almost as small as a pin. I seriously doubt that ....
Well it is improbable... but didn't they say it was a very small disturbance?
Given the number of variables in this situation... the planet's position as a satelite, the time between eruptions, the rotation of the star (if it rotates)...
The relative positions of the eruption and the planet would probably not be the same...
I don't think there can be any logic to back up this episode...
Posted by: bigjohn_1972 Dec 3rd 2006, 3:58 PM
Wow, hectagon, you don't here that one too much!
a hectagon is a polygon with 100 edges.
I liked this episode, though the Teyla and Ronon thing seemed a little strained to me, just didn't seem natural. Maybe it's just me. I'm liking the Shep/Weir however!
The coronal mass ejection seemed a little unrealistic the way it was portrayed, but I guess the idea was to block out that portion of it that would go towards Atlantis, which is plausible.
Posted by: Pitry Dec 3rd 2006, 4:00 PM
I was also very pleased that Teyla and Ronon actually did something in this episode.
Let's hope they keep it up that way - at least Ronon and Teyla would finally et a point! *hopeful*
Grace Under PRessure.... at some point he goes liek "an alien whale and I treat him like Lassy" ;)
Without the background (i.e knowing why Sam comes to Rodney's mind when he thinks of hte whale) I do see why Sheppard would think it creepy, tho
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hectagon is a polygon with 100 edges... I was going for the "too much ship!" angle
Posted by: Revan Dec 3rd 2006, 6:22 PM
Let's hope they keep it up that way - at least Ronon and Teyla would finally et a point! *hopeful*
Grace Under PRessure.... at some point he goes liek "an alien whale and I treat him like Lassy" ;)
Without the background (i.e knowing why Sam comes to Rodney's mind when he thinks of hte whale) I do see why Sheppard would think it creepy, tho
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hectagon is a polygon with 100 edges... I was going for the "too much ship!" angle
Okay, now I am less confused. Though perhaps I should brush up on my geometry.
I remember now... hmm Lassy....
Posted by: juks89 Dec 4th 2006, 9:08 AM
I think it wasn?t bad ep. but it was too slow, compared to the previous one. I liked to see Sheppard following McKay all the time listening him speaking scientificly 
I don?t thing he understood most of the stuff Meredith prattled.
Posted by: bigjohn_1972 Dec 5th 2006, 8:40 PM
That leads to a question I have, is it Meredeth, or Merideth?
Posted by: Pitry Dec 7th 2006, 10:06 AM
That leads to a question I have, is it Meredeth, or Merideth?
Isn't it Meredith? Think you've misplaced your i's
Posted by: KillerMarv Dec 7th 2006, 1:07 PM
Loved this episode. Simply loved it.
1. Those whales were so damn cute... Hidding under the city from the big bad sun. 
2. The way the wahles communicated the information, and more importantly, the fact that the information was not useful at all...
3. Teyla and Ronon look like they're developing something. Should be worth seing further on.
4. Rodney!!!!!!!!!!
Great episode. 5/5
Posted by: Pitry Dec 7th 2006, 4:11 PM
Loved this episode. Simply loved it.
1. Those whales were so damn cute... Hidding under the city from the big bad sun.
2. The way the wahles communicated the information, and more importantly, the fact that the information was not useful at all...
3. Teyla and Ronon look like they're developing something. Should be worth seing further on.
4. Rodney!!!!!!!!!!
Great episode. 5/5
1 + 4:
"It's a fish! A big big fish!"
I just love Rodney
Posted by: bigjohn_1972 Dec 7th 2006, 9:27 PM
Isn't it Meredith? Think you've misplaced your i's
You could be correct, or you just opened a big can of worms!!
Is it Meridith, Merideth, Meredith, or Meredeth???
Posted by: Pitry Dec 8th 2006, 12:03 PM
Megadeth!
Posted by: Callum121 Dec 11th 2006, 3:01 PM
LMAO in this episode i find it really funny when both sheppard and mckay cannot hear and they have to shout sheppard then says in the infermary that canadian football sucks and then calls him maradith lol i found this funny haha
Posted by: More Cowbell! Dec 12th 2006, 1:22 PM
The general consensus around the net is that it's Meredith....
Anyway, loved the ep - can't say I'm too keen to see Ronon and Teyla actually getting together, but a little sexual tension between the 2 would probably spice things up for both of them as characters I think...
Didn't it seem a little fake to you? There was something just entirely weird about that.
Posted by: Revan Dec 15th 2006, 3:45 PM
Didn't it seem a little fake to you? There was something just entirely weird about that.
Not necessarily. Those two really should be close. They train together all the time, they go on missions... they should at least be very good friends, and, being attractive male and female... they could conceivably be attracted to each other romantically. I thought there were only romantic undertones... nothing too overt.
Posted by: glom Jan 11th 2007, 3:01 PM
63% The tree huggy aspect was quite cute and I did like the whole creepy visions thing. Quite science fictioney.
COINCIDENCE OF THE WEEK: Two years ago, the Atlantis expedition had arrived just in time for the hundred year storm. Now, we find out they've arrived just in time for the 15,000 year storm.
CREEPINESS OF THE WEEK: That Whale Ancient sure did have a cool sound to it.
NON-CANADIAN OF THE WEEK: Rem is the US unit of radiation dose equivalent. Why would the Canadian McKay not be using sieverts?
NEW ASTROPHYSICS OF THE WEEK: That was some laser precision solar flare. A star hundreds of thousands of kilometres across, ejecting matter a couple of million kilometres out into space to where the Daedalus was and the stream is only a few dozen kilometres across.
ONE-DIMENSIONALITY OF THE WEEK: Solar flares are directional as we saw (though that solar flare was comically directional). A solar system is a large amount of real estate. The idea that the Atlantis planet would be hit like clockwork seems to miss the very real possibility that the solar flare could go in another direction.
Posted by: Dafmeister Jan 17th 2007, 4:12 PM
Such a good episode. Atlantis has been so strong so far in season 3. McKay naming the whale Sam was great and Sheppard trying to insult the deaf McKay by Celine Dion is not all she is cracked up to be and Canadian football is pointless were funny as hell.
One thing I noticed, McKay asked why the Ancients didn't use a ship 15,000 years ago to deflect the CME but Sheppard said they were in the middle of a war. What war? It wasn't the Wraith as that lasted the hundred or so years before they returned to Earth. He couldn't have been referring to the Asurans as they were created as a weapon against the Wraith. So who were they at war with?
Posted by: JTMAG1 Jan 17th 2007, 4:57 PM
One thing I noticed, McKay asked why the Ancients didn't use a ship 15,000 years ago to deflect the CME but Sheppard said they were in the middle of a war. What war? It wasn't the Wraith as that lasted the hundred or so years before they returned to Earth. He couldn't have been referring to the Asurans as they were created as a weapon against the Wraith. So who were they at war with?
That's a good point, I didn't notice that. i will have to watch again.
Posted by: Jade Jan 23rd 2007, 6:42 AM
ok episode, nothing special, few good points, whale Sam Sheppard's comment, Celine Dion, Canadian football etc. cool FX
Posted by: JC1 Jan 23rd 2007, 5:55 PM
An ok episode and quite funny in places. I found Caldwells suggestion of killing the whales with drones kind of funny. Not only is it a bit harsh, but its waste of drones.
Kind of agree with Mckay about the ZPM's, though. Ok give one to weapons platform, but giving one to the Odyssey seems like kind of a waste. Sure the shields will be stronger, but the weapons will still be completely ineffective.
Posted by: Parmenides Jan 27th 2007, 9:27 PM
Wow, so the Ancients picked a pretty sucky planet to harbour Atlantis on - first The Storm, and now this?
Crazy whale-lady was scary. I did not like her voice, it was very grating, which I suppose was the point. Didn't like all that techno-lark about communicating with the whales. I've had enough of genetic memory with the Goa'uld, too - though I suppose without it, the episode doesn't really work.
Heightmeyer was...off. I really liked her in the previous episodes we had seen her in, but in this one she was a bit tragic - I actually thought she was being played by a different actress. The hair made her look younger, and less sage, and her acting was so hammy and incidental, I almost thought it was on purpose, and she knew more than she was letting on. Teyla was good, but I was hoping for the episode to focus more on her, at the beginning - I was a bit disappointed when it turned out everyone had the visions...but it turned out to be a pretty good episode anyway.
I should probably complain about the coronal mass ejection, given that I'm an astronomy student...but meh, I'm willing to suspend my disbelief. It would've been better if the stream had been less perfect though...and given the sheer unlikelihood of it hitting Atlantia, given the beam's size, I would've preferred if they'd said it would envelope a larger portion of the planet's orbit - then I wouldn't gripe as much about the probability of it happening twice.
ZPMs, woop.
Posted by: KillerMarv Feb 1st 2007, 4:28 AM
The way that coronal mass ejection looked in this episode, it reminded me of the Ori weapons they use on their ships. The only difference would be that the Ori warship's fire is probably much weaker than this. But if the Daedalus fared so well against it with a ZPM (I'm not saying without damage), surely we could stand more against an Ori warship.
Posted by: Sam_Carter Mar 1st 2007, 1:44 PM
i mostly liked this episode because of the character developements..
i thought the Teyla and Ronan interaction didn't look forced.. and they had scenes before.. i think they would make a nice couple (i might turn into a Teyla/Ronan shipper)
but i liked all the interactions of all the characters and i had a lot to laugh
I didn't like the fact that the frequency created by the whales killed ppl, i think it is ok for them to warn the ppl on atlantis.. but kill them?
it would have made more sense if mccay would have found something in the database to counteract the effects..
about that whole sun emission thing... I'm no scientist but it was hard for me to believe that the daedalus was able to deflect that beam without any serious damage to the ship.. i guess here it shows again how powerfull a ZPM really is
Posted by: Cindy Apr 6th 2007, 5:23 AM
very nice ep. shep carrying weir and ronon never leaving teylas bedside 
aww. the whole coronal mass emission being reflected by the daedalus was awesome.
Very funny when shep and mckay were in the infirmary and shep was yelling ramdom things that would normaly annoy mckay and he only looked up when shep called him meredith
I for one hated the noises those hollograms made 
very annoying
Posted by: startreksuite Apr 20th 2007, 10:26 PM
Great episode! Didn't know that they were going to steal a little bit of Star Trek IV here! Of course the whales here were trying to warn Atlantis of an impending threat, not just look for their friends! Loved it when Shep tested Rodney's hearing and said, "Zelenka is smarter than you!", and "Meredith!" All of the ideas came together well for this ep!
Posted by: Sylver Apr 21st 2007, 6:21 AM
One thing I noticed, McKay asked why the Ancients didn't use a ship 15,000 years ago to deflect the CME but Sheppard said they were in the middle of a war. What war? It wasn't the Wraith as that lasted the hundred or so years before they returned to Earth. He couldn't have been referring to the Asurans as they were created as a weapon against the Wraith. So who were they at war with?
I noticed that, too. I was under the impression that the war lasted long, but it was something like 10,000 years ago as opposed to 15,000. Which isn't a lot during that scale, but still wouldn't be during this particular time. And why did the beam of light head directly for Atlantis? All that empty space and the planet's sitting right there. I hope it had more to offer than giant sea life and an ocean for them to build on, it's not turning out to be very hospitable, lol.
Great character interaction, I loved the Teyla/Ronan parts - finally! They get whole scenes, not just amusedly sarcastic looks or a couple of quips. And McKay, well I always love him, and his Samantha obsession is bizarrely (and creepily) cute. Zelenka - so underused, this was the perfect episode to have him in. He's the perfect scientific foil for McKay.
Those accolades said, I wish there was a little more character growth. There was great interaction, but they were all reacting to the (big, giant) whales and the effects of their song. Eh, I guess I can't have everything I want in one episode.
Posted by: Kate Apr 21st 2007, 4:55 PM
Good ep. Wasn't fond of the warped voices either. I loved the interaction with Sheppard and McKay!
Posted by: Dafmeister Apr 21st 2007, 6:41 PM
Posted by: ancient01 Apr 21st 2007, 7:48 PM
I thought the episode was ok, but just that. I can't really say why, but it just didn't keep my interest much. I think the pacing of the story was off. It was pretty convenient that they got the Daedelus in position and the zpm online at exactly the time that the discharge started. Dramatic effect is one thing, but wan't the timing a little contrived? I still can't say I didn't enjoy it, though. Maybe I'm just hard up for new episodes...
Posted by: Sighfienerd Apr 21st 2007, 10:31 PM
Good point, Hobo - about the CME being shown as a concentrated ray and not a more randomly-shaped explosion, because if it had been the latter...that suuurre would have caused a problem in the resolution of this storyline.
I liked the episode, though I'm thinking it was a bit of a stretch (even with McKay's brilliance) to be able to determine the exact nature of the threat in such a short period of time.given its extreme rarity. It seemed just way too glib and facile, although the ancient woman's "language" was a dead giveaway that the communication came from the whales.
And I don't know, but wouldn't bleeding from the ears indicate some kind of really serious damage, such as burst eardrums? But ahhh...I can go with the flow....
I did like both Teyla and Ronan in this ep too. They both seem more spontaneous and natural and "real," if you will. I don't know about sexual chemistry there though - they seem more brother and sister to me. 
That pairing seems too obvious and humdrum anyway. Now, I think Weir could yank his dreds....
Posted by: IndyJan Apr 22nd 2007, 1:22 AM
Okay, I have to say it, they finally gave Teyla something to do that wasn't just standing around and hitting on people.
I loved this episode because Zelenka was in it and had a pretty good part. I cracked up, Shep came up with the idea to save the day, not Rodney. I get so sick and tired of it being Rodney all the time.
I did like the whales, first to warn them, then to hide themselves and save themselves, LOL! Shep, "wonder what they taste like?" 
So three ZPMs, but Atlantis only has one. Poor Rodney, he wanted them all.
Posted by: Teyla Emmagan Apr 22nd 2007, 5:46 PM
This over all my fav so far anyways .
I wished that John and Teyla where sparring when she began to see the visions .
And Teyla and Ronon becoming a couple no offense save your breath . And it's all Brother and Sister relationship . And John seemed really broken up after he asked Ronon how she was doing towards the end .
But I'm a 
Sheyla shipper anyway but overall i can love this one for everyone's part love weir
Attached image(s)
Posted by: KillerMarv Apr 23rd 2007, 2:00 PM
But I'm a
Sheyla shipper anyway but overall i can love this one for everyone's part love weirYes, we can tell that you're a Teyla shipper. And I presume that Sheyla means Sheppard + Teyla. You should take it as a joke, but Sheyla really sounds weird. Teyppard would have been much better.
On second thought, neah... I think we should leave their names intact.
Posted by: IndyJan Apr 23rd 2007, 4:59 PM
Yes, we can tell that you're a Teyla shipper. And I presume that Sheyla means Sheppard + Teyla. You should take it as a joke, but Sheyla really sounds weird. Teyppard would have been much better.
On second thought, neah... I think we should leave their names intact.
I doubt it makes any difference since they really haven't even hinted at a Shep/Teyla thing. But they have hinted at a Teyla and Ronin thing.
Posted by: Dafmeister Apr 23rd 2007, 6:55 PM
Posted by: IndyJan Apr 24th 2007, 2:38 AM
They've hinted at a Sheppard/Teyla releationship a few times. The sexual tension when we first see Teyla training Sheppard is clear and the scene where Sheppard kisses Teyla in 'Conversion' also hints that he feels something for her and more so when they are fighting in that episode.
I don't want a ship thing on Atlantis, but if it did happen, I have seen more tension and shippiness between Weir and Shep than Teyla and Shep. Shep and Teyla do not work for me. Maybe I don't want it because for me, at least, Teyla is a wasted character and should actually be gone from the show.
Posted by: thefirstone Apr 24th 2007, 12:03 PM
I also agree that if there was going to be a ship it would be Shep and Weir or Teyla and Ronon. I personally hate shipping, It makes the show seem less of a sci-fi and more of a soap opera. If I want soap operas I'll watch Eastenders(British Soap opera) or something.
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