Okay, well... I do have to agree with the concensus, SGA's season finale was much better than Stargate's. And I was really surprized at how GREAT it was.

Now, once again, I do have one minor complaint and someone has already pointed it out. The story wasn't terribly original. Yeah, it's "Die Hard" with Sheppard playing the Bruce Willis role and to my most wonderous surprize, Robert Davi playing the kidnapper terrorist role. He was excellent as Commander Koyla and here's your second Die Hard connection since he played an FBI agent in that movie.

Boy, you've got to give Mallozi and team credit for getting these little details right.

See, as much as I really really enjoyed this episode, the story was just a re-hash of
Die Hard. You've got the city evacuated because of the storm. In Die Hard, there were only a handful of people in the tower for a Christmas party. Then you've got the terrorists who really turn out to be thieves because ultimately, they were after the items in the company's vault. In the Storm, you've got hte Genii terrorists acting as thieves originally trying to steal "technology" but in the end stealing the city.

Alright, I could be just nitpicking a wee bit too much. But, all in all, this was a particularly exciting show. The pacing was excellent. There were just the right amounts of humor... as provided by McKay. Although, he was just a tad overbearing this week. Did love the superman reference. Love the Czech scientist. Hope we get to see more of him since I think that both he and Beckett are good foils for Mckay. At least, they both seem to be able to handle the guy.

And gee, if the Genii aren't becoming far far more interesting than the Wraith as an enemy ! Shoot, they've definitely shown some serious initiative.

I love the scene (albiet a short one) between Koyla and Cowan (sp?) ... Just seeing Robert Davi and Colm Meany acting together was such a thrill. See, now... here's what can happen when you have talented character actors playing to perfection. I thought Colm Meany was fantastic as the revenge driven Genii leader. And I what a thrill it was to see Robert Davi's name in the opening credits. I haven't seen him since Profiler and I was a huge fan of Profiler. That small scene was just so well done.

Now... you know who's really growing on me ? the slacker Major Sheppard. I've got to say that his character is developing nicely. And his hair wasn't bothering me either. At least, it didn't seem as much as a rat's nest as it had in prior episodes.

Actually, everyone was really very good in the finale. The writers really need to give Lt Ford something important to do. Because in general, I don't see the poor guy being giving any good material to work with.

I thought it was a great idea to use the storm as a means of bringing in the Genii. I mean, talk about an opportunity for them. But, also a way of "breaking" up the team into different groups. I liked how they were more or less split up into different teams i.e. Teyla (who I liked quite a bit), Ford (needs better material) and Beckett (my favorite sci-fi doctor). Mckay and Weir. Then the ever resourceful Major Sheppard.

hmmm... so what are they going to do about Dr Weir. You know, they aren't going to kill her off. I'm sure the actress had a contract for the full season. But, hopefully, the writers will do more to enhance her character.

let's see, do I have a nitpick ? a small complaint really. Here's where having a Zat would have been a good thing. Instead of Sheppard killing the Genii assault team a la Bruce Willis, he could have zatted 'em.

I'm sure I've got lots of other stuff to say. But, this really was a fabulous episode.

can't believe I have to wait til January or to see what happens ! but, you've got to figure that some how... Sheppard will end up in a big confrontation/fight scene with
Commander Koyla. Teyla and Sorra will fight and ultimately, McKay and the Czech scientist will find a way to save the city from the Storm.

9/10 is my score.

oh, and SGA/Stargate really need to get different teams of writers on each show because once again... stealing the gate on Stargate... hmmm... stealing the city in SGA.

This post has been edited by CitizenK: Sep 22nd 2004, 4:27 AM

now that was a nice read, your views are quite good.
I don't think Teyla and Sorra will fight though.
Sorra seems to be upset by Koyla's actions and she's already started saying that it's not a cool thing to do...not in those words though.
She will be one of our saviours...right at the end

I have mixed feelings about this episode; on the one hand the story and plot is pretty well done, the visual effects are very convincing, and the action is okay. On the other, Sheppard doesn't seem to be aggressive enough for a military officer. Instead of trying to kill the enemy, he's just negotiating. Commander Kolya doesn't seem badass, he just seems like a man still troubled by a life-threatening case of acne as a youth. The acting, while improving overall, still isn't great. I get the feeling that the writers didn't really define their characters very well when they invented them, so now the actors have to try to make up for it.

One thing that bugs me is that Sheppard's not really hardcore. He can defend himself, but he's just not the kind of guy that wants to kill the enemy. I would have used some of that C-4 to set up an ambush just outside that last crystal-thingy. Shep's got that ancient motion tracker, so he'd know just when to set it off and take out the guys sent to capture him. Would have been a whole lot easier and safer than trying to get the upper hand with the P(os)90.

This ep has been compared several times to Die Hard, but I'm still waiting for something on the order of "now I have a machine-gun." 'Till next time, folks, it's fists with your toes.

PS- Oh, yeah. Anybody feel the tension when Kolya threatened to shoot Weir? Anyone? Me neither.

This post has been edited by Gunfighter: Sep 23rd 2004, 9:57 PM

oh come on...there was tension in his voice, you just had to listen to it..he was being...i don't know what the word is for it...but he was like that other guy in Die Hard who was played by Alan Rickman.
You don't need to have a really bad menacing voice to sound threatning.

And why should Sheppard blow up others?
their job is not to go out shooting but to be peaceful.
They went to Atlantis on a PEACEFUL mission not to have enemies come into Atlantis, take over and then for them to shoot all the bad guys..and that would be totally uninteresting as well.

Christy has a point, Gunfighter. The military contingent that went with the scientists to Atlantis weren't there to fight a war. They were they to protect them and provide security. It is supposed to be a scientific and diplomatic mission, not a military one.

And I have to remind you that during a hostage situation, police officers will always negotiate with the hostage takers first. They will always try to broker their release without having to use force. The SWAT teams are only used as a last resort.

I think that Sheppard is being very smart. He's seeing what his options are and then waiting for the right time to make his move once he has a plan of action. He also has to consider what Koyla is going to do. What if he does start shooting hostages ?

Sheppard's job is to ensure the safety of the mission. Mckay, Weir and company are being held hostage and some how, he has to rescue them. In the meantime, a monster hurricane is bearing down on the city. What's he supposed to do ? He has to find a way to protect his friends and collegues. You just don't go into a situation like that with guns blaring... would you want this to end up like that hostage crisis in Russia ? no, I don't think you would. So, No Sheppard isn't the sort of man who wants to just "kill" people and am I glad of that. He's a nice normal human being. Not some mindless soul-less killing machine.

and hey, I love Robert Davi as Koyla. As Christy says, you don't have to have a glare or stare to be menacing. Some times, it's just the tone of your voice that can convey fear. I think the guy is great. And, I'm glad he isn't one of those pretty boys from the OC !! I believe a man should carry some character in his face.

two more of my cents


This post has been edited by CitizenK: Sep 24th 2004, 8:03 AM

ah CitizenK...you sure know how to make a person feel like their opinions are right.
I don't mind the OC oh though i do agree with the pretty face part.
HOW COME ALL SHOWS HAVE PRETTY BOYS?
Atlantis is good because they're not all love gods.

I didn't say I wanted a pretty boy character on the show; I'm just saying that the acne-survivor look was the only thing distinctive about the Kolya character. He seemed to be more bored than menacing. And since you know he's not going to kill anybody who has their name in the credits, the threat seemed pretty lame. Shep kinda went limp like a wet noodle at the end there, too. You try to negotiate to buy some time, but you don't just give in to the enemy's demands. It sets a bad precedent, kinda like the Indian airliner crisis a few years ago. It's pure behavioral psychology- show the enemy that you'll give in when they push, and they'll learn that they can control you. Yes, in police situations, negotiations are attempted before the SWAT team goes in, but there are several things that need to be considered.

First of all, even if the police are able to communicate and negotiate with the suspect, there is never a chance that the suspect will be allowed to walk away- the suspect WILL be apprehended, negotiations or no. The negotiator isn't going to give the suspect what he wants, but rather is going to try to talk him out of doing anything foolish.

Secondly, I would venture to say that in most cases when hostages are an issue, they are there simply because the suspect is getting desperate. The suspect needs a shield between himself and the SWAT team; he's not often willing to die if it can be in any way avoided. This instinct for survival, in conjunction with the threat of force from the SWAT team, is what the negotiator is playing with.

Third, and somewhat related, a hostage-taking criminal (or any criminal, for that matter) is typically acting in his own self-interest. Whether it's a robbery gone wrong, or they're trying to satisfy some sort of emotional need in a crime of passion, there is rarely anything more important to the suspect than himself. He doesn't answer to any higher authority. A criminal is almost always lacking determination and discipline.

The Genii assualt team is a very different adversary, and has to be treated as such. First of all, they came to Atlantis with a strategic objective. Although they may be there to steal weapons and supplies, they're not going for personal gain. They're adhering to a set plan and a chain of command, consciously risking their lives for their objectives, and that makes them determined to succeed. For the moment, Kolya is holding all the cards except for the C-4. The Genii outnumber and outgun Sheppard, obviously, and they also have bargaining chips in the form of Drs. Weir and McKay. Kolya is in the position of strength, and he's not desperate. He's in control.

Shep does have a couple advantages, though. First of all, of course, he's got the C-4 that Kolya has been ordered to get. The other advantage is Kolya's secondary objective- to capture key Atlantis personnel. Prisoners are always a welcome source of information, and the higher ranking they are, the better. He's already got McKay and Weir, but he's also anxious to capture the military leader as well. Coupled with the fact that the C-4 is missing, as well as the limited time available before the storm hits, Sheppard becomes too valuable to kill- at least until Kolya becomes truly desperate. Seeing as how Weir is the highest ranking person at Atlantis, she's also too valuable to kill, as is McKay, with his knowledge of atomic weapons among various other subjects. Kolya's threat can be nothing but a bluff; because of his inexperience, or perhaps emotional attachment, Sheppard is unable to see this and use it to his advantage.

Oh yeah, and there is something to be said for having actors that don't all look like they've stepped out of a soap opera. There's nothing wrong with having a little mileage under your belt, or perhaps your eyes. Visible age can often give a character a distinguished air or perhaps a bit of visual authority. I'm don't think I would go for the Tommy Lee Jones look that Kolya has, though. The Grand Canyon's nice to visit but I'm not sure I'd like to see it in the mirror. As a side note, I find it kind of funny (and also somewhat sad) that Ford's only character description is that he's "boyishly good looking," according to the official Atlantis web page at SciFi.

Oh, yeah, before I forget...

I take it you found Die Hard pretty boring, then?

They fight. If you watch the spoilers- *cough* um, I mean the previews, you'll see two long haired chicks fighting. Or maybe they're just twirling around, I dunno... but the only ones with long hair are Sora and Teyla.

Blaugh. I type too much.

This post has been edited by Gunfighter: Sep 26th 2004, 12:30 AM

Sure, you're right about the hostage situation Gunfighter. However, what does Kolya have to lose by killing Weir? His dignity? He doesn't need that. He's got everything he needs except the C4, and Kolya knows that Sheppard hid the C4, not Weir. As a matter of fact, all he has to do technically is forget about the C4, kill Weir, take McKay back to his world and hold him prisoner there, and let that portion of the city be destroyed, because there doesn't appear to be anything anyone can do to save that part of it, unless I missed something here. That achieves most of his goals and that's probably what I would do. There isn't really any valuable information that he can gain from Weir.

This post has been edited by bob is almighty: Sep 26th 2004, 1:04 AM

IMHO, SG-A eps1 & 2 were a bit rushed in the story line, it wasnt allowed to develop as you would expect as it was one set of issues after another which bogged the story down.

Some one menyioned TNG and the theme tune, if you ever listen to it and TNG you will see that they are totally different, who ever that muppet is should take a short course in music production.

The EP110 is a bit of a cliff hanger, I have been waiting a couple of weeks for ep111 to download but none have been posted is their a break since ep110? as all the eps I have are from the US, show times are different in the UK to the US and currently only showing on SKY one, again restrictive because I aint got it.

hmmm... lots of good points, gunfighter.

However, how do we know he isn't going to kill Weir ? We're at the halfway point for the SGA season. Why wouldn't Commander Koyla kill Weir ? I ask that because, there have been lots and lots of posts from forum members, who would love to get rid of Weir. Why wouldn't the producers take the opportunity to remove a character that no one (okay, not everyone, but most) people dislike ?

Yeah, I know, she's in the opening credits, the chances of her character getting killed off are pretty slim. But, who knows... it's an opportunity to make changes teaser or no teaser.

Now, about the C-4. Yes, that was the original objective of the Genii. But, why do they need the C-4 now that they are in possession of Atlantis ? Here's all this technology far superior to C-4 just waiting to be taken. And... as you rightly stated, they have two of the senior scientists (one possessing the ancient's gene) that can help them learn and use that technology. So, they don't need the C-4 anymore.

Also, killing off Weir would be a bad thing at this point, since she does have all that knowledge of the city, albiet knowledge that was still being learned. They also have Mckay who bragged about his abilities to create an atom bomb. Cowen has to consider that information more important than the C-4.

However, Koyla strikes me as an intelligent man. He knows that whoever holds the city has a chance to defeat the Wraith. And ultimately, isn't that what the Genii are all about ? They are looking for a way to defend themselves against the Wraith like every other culture in the pegasus system ? They didn't strike me as a culture bent on militaristic expansion.

I'm suprized that you considered Sheppard to be wet noodle-like towards the end of the episode. I actually thought he was acting exactly like Bruce Willis did in Die Hard.
I'm just waiting for him to utter that immortal line,"Yippe kay-yeh mother... " you all know the line. and you know, he's going to have some sort of cute witicism for Koyla in part 2.

Still, I do believe Sorra and Teyla will have a big confrontation scene (as will Sheppard and Koyla) and not because of the teaser credits.

Sorra still considered Teyla responsible for her father's death. She wants her revenge. So, they'll be a big fight scene. I speculate that Teyla will win and that Sorra will probably die some herioc death. Yeah, I'm figuring if anyone gets killed in part 2, it's probably Sorra. She's the most expendable at this point.

You know, I really ought to go rewatch Die Hard this weekend. Maybe it'll give me some insight into what the writers have planned for part 2.

Oh, enjoyed your hostage essage, gunfighter !

Oh yeah, did anyone ever consider the fact that Kolya might be bluffing?

This post has been edited by bob is almighty: Sep 26th 2004, 4:55 PM

Sorry for the minor spoiler. I'm just a fan of irony, though.

Yeah!!!!! Here's some HOT GIRL ON GIRL action rolling on!!!

Heh. Actually, I believe that, that photo is from the second part of, The Storm.

Nevertheless, you are correct, in all your sarcasm, they will be fighting -- sooner or later, and hopefully they will make up and Sorra will become one of the "Atlantians."

I have a soft spot for her for some reason...

This post has been edited by Aquila: Sep 26th 2004, 11:06 PM

Oh please. Maybe Ford will find an honorable death trying to be a hero. Then Sorra takes his place on the team. She appears to be cut out for bigger things than him.

Edit: Why did Kolya take his most amateurish team? He said they weren't ready yet. Don't have the Genii anyone who IS ready? Sorra's father is the only "capable" person which died in Underground, but there should be others.

This post has been edited by ted_simple: Sep 27th 2004, 2:22 PM

Unfortunately, Moon Catchin' doesn't seem to have a transcript of the first Genii episode (strangely, neither do the first five or six sites I Googled), so I can't get an exact quote... but I believe the Genii were interested in the C-4 as a component of their atomic bombs, as they didn't have the resources or perhaps the technology to create an advanced high explosive. (If you want a quickie course on C-4 in layman's terms (mostly), you might be interested in this.) They probably wanted to examine the explosive and then reproduce it. If the Genii could conceal facilities large enough to produce fissile material, they could easily conceal a high explosives plant. (More on nuclear weapons can be found here.)

True, Atlantis has a lot of high-tech gadgets, most of them probably still undiscovered... but, seeing as how the Ancients were a more benevolent race, I would bet against finding much in the way of weapons of mass destruction, especially ones that could be used without the Ancient gene. Yeah, the Atlantis team was artificially imbued with the Ancient gene, but it's a bad idea to depend on unwilling prisoners for your highest national security projects. Plus, the city looks like it's going to sink in a couple hours (we know better, but Kolya doesn't realize he's just a TV character), so it's a safe bet that the Genii want to get in and out as fast as possible.

Oh yeah, and I have a suggestion for improving the Gate room defenses:

Claymores.

This post has been edited by Gunfighter: Sep 27th 2004, 5:16 PM

I have a better suggestion for the gate room. Why not add shields to the room itself. If we do let anyone in through the gate, then they are still isolated in the gateroom, and possible neutralized before they get anywhere.

as usual, energy concerns...it takes a lot of energy just to shield the gate, let alone the entire gate room area. And what would that have accomplished in this episode, the soldiers disabled the shield anyway, and they thought they were Athosians till they got shot by them =) Besides, what would you do even if you had a Wraith incursion in a shielded gate room, dial back out and ask them nicely to go home? =) The only way that might work is if you just shielded the area right in front of the gate, so that if anyone nasty came through you dial back out and let the event horizon outflux disintegrate them - assuming they dont send some kind of Wraith uber-bomb that takes out the shield before you can disable it, heh

You meant "The Storm" is Stargate Atlantis Mid-Season Finale

yes but that would take sooo long...they'd have to take down both shields and all that and..while it is a good idea i just think that it would be too hard to do.

My problem with The Storm is this - I think they should have used Ford - at least a little, in this episode.

In the season premiere, Ford tracked Shepard's boot marks to the Wraith Queen's "dining room," shot the Wraith guards between the eyes, and rescued Shepard. I realized that Ford probably had special forces training while Shepard was a pilot in the Air force serving in Antarctica. I would venture to say that Ford is probably a much more accurate shooter and hand to hand combatant.

Shepard, in his role of leader of the team, should be in charge of tactics and strategy (like when he brought two extra PJs to the Genii planet as backup). But he should leave the heavy shooting, sneak and peak, hand to hand, etc. to Ford, who has the training and experience.

I guess the Storm episode was too important to be handled only by Ford, but he's the one who should be sneaking around Atlantis, not Shepard.

As a highly trained soldier, Ford would finally have a purpose to being on the team... and on the show. His skills would be marksmanship, camouflage and sneaking around undetected, etc...

Hopefully, Ford and Teyla can get back to the city in the next episode and lend a hand - it would be much more exciting than seeing Shepard miraculously kill off all the Genii singlehandidly... maybe they can take the PJ underwater and get in through a different opening underneath the city, so the Genii don't see them arrive. It makes sense that after being in Atlantis for a while already, the team will have learnt some of its secrets and use their knowledge to take out the Genii.

I was also thinking that if the Asgard have transport technology (and installed it on Prometheous), so did the Ancients... so all Shepard has to do is find the right control panel, and beam all the Genii right into the sheilded cell where he was keeping Steve : )

This post has been edited by coaldat6: Oct 11th 2004, 3:40 PM

i was just thinking, it would be normal for mcay to give in to torquer, he's not trained to withstand it. And kolya looked more like a south american drug lord than a badass military commander to me, but he did a great acting job as did most of crew except ford who just looks like than dark skinned guy on csi-miami, i can't wait to see how this turns out. But did anyone notice how at the end of the episode the camera backed out from that tiny window to a total view of the city just like in the first sg1 2-parter the camera backed out from the windows of the goa'uld mothership to a total view of the ship, did anyone else notice this?

can't say i did notice, i'm not one to be able to pick up all of those nitpicks..lol.
at this moment in time, i've been thinking about the episode and am starting to think just how old is it..like, you know when you've seen a series wnhen you were younger than then it get's reran on t.v...that's my thought on Atlantis at this moment, only because there hasn't been a new episode out and i've watched other shows in the meantime.

Funny Quote:

MCKAY: What is the one thing keeping us from having a shield
WEIR : That would...
MCKAY: Power! And what does a megastorm from hell have a lot of?
WEIR : Power.
MCKAY: In the form of?
WEIE: You want to build a windmill?

This post has been edited by Krystian SG1: Nov 13th 2004, 3:51 PM