Doubt it to be honest. They seem far too small to compare them. They look cool but it's probably closer to a Dart in size than it is a Cruiser. It would be good though to get a further look at them in the future.

Hopefully Shep's team will return in the near future & perhaps get their hands on all the tech that is lying around, Including them flying the ships up to Daedalus. Can't see them being space pirates but you never know.

What I don't like about this episode is Weir, she took a moral stance in S1 when Ford suggested they take the ZPM from 'Childhood's end', then after someone risked her life to inform them of a potential plot. She just sat back & let them take her away for trial & as a punishment a lifetime holiday to the island.

This season she has more smugness in her or you could call it fire in her belly, either way I don't like it. If she sets the tone then she should stick to it.

Letting the prisoners escape was another thing that bugged me. Some of them were multiple murderers, So it would have been better to send them to a known Wraith planet or the one with the Bugs, T-Rex's etc.

Lastly I can't see them keeping the scientist around. I think they will ship him off to the Athosians where he could make some valuable contributions to their society on the mainland.

I can't exactly say what was wrong with the episode but it just didn't keep my interest, for the first time ever in a stargate episode i found myself not giving it my full attention! The best i can come it with as to why was there weren't that many funny parts, it seemed very like an old SG1 ep. and consequently it was quite predictable.

I would give this episode 4/10.

Did anyone else have small flashbacks to SG-1s "Prisoners"? (where they have a prison on a pratically uninhabited planet, no DHD, but there is a stargate to provide food and more prisoners).

SGA started off this season pretty good, but the lack of a flowing story line is starting to show already. I want to see some actual plot after Seige III and not just more "oh, well now that we're here let's see what happens". Like what are their plans for the wraith now? etc.

I also don't like the fact that Ronan is turning into a Tayla/Teal'c so far. I hope he finds a little niche and doesn't end up the big, bumbling meat shield for everyone else.

I agree. There seems to be no aim for the season and instead they are just making unconnected episodes that stand on their own but add nothing to the Stargate universe.

I started watching it again tonight on TMN but got bored and turned the channel. Not a good sign indeed.

Let's not forget the valuable fact that the Wraith are not a single force to be reckoned with. It was revealed that they are in fact seperate groups, with individual motives/agendas almost to the point of behaving cooperatively with Humans, "I'll scratch your back if you promise not to kill us". This may prove to be advantageous to us if we can use their territorial behaviour against them. With Atlantis out of the picture, we can try and covertly incite Wraith Factions to decimate one another over food. Then again that's already been done in SG-1 with the Goa'uld blood bath.

The one good lesson that they should have learnt coming from this episode is to enter the Stargate in Stealth Mode until the situation on the other side has been assessed as being safe. There's nothing stopping them from doing that. If it is technically impossible to do that due to the way the PJ operates as it goes through a Stargate, then the least they can do is to always immediately engage Stealth Mode the moment they arrive. Then the risk of blowing Atlantis' cover will be minimised.

This post has been edited by dr_n_tesla: Aug 19th 2005, 2:08 AM

Yes I kept wanting to hear "the first thing I see. Destroyer of Worlds" and see Rodney challenge some big bafoon to a fight.
Yes More of a plot but its early in the season so this is when they get to throw in there fun EPs then the real story starts to kick in
Yes Ronan seems like hes going to get the line "take point and Look Scary" like the old Teal'c

This EP had a good source of humor too i liked the fact that the heaad prisioner describing Rodney. Also Rodney's MacGuyver and Braveheart references I was laughing so hard when he said:
McKay: What am I, MacGyver? Fix it with what?

Actually that statement about MacGyver took me back to "Children of the Gods" S1 SG I think it was. When Carter talked about MacGyvering the SGC computer to work the Stargate. It just seemed old to me.

Yes, very old.

well you may not have liked it but I enjoy anyshot at RDA's former show

I had originally thought that they could do this, after all we have seen other races do this & be able to cloak while coming through the gate like the reetou etc. So why not the PJ's, there have been a few times where I though it was possible like in 'Rising' where he talks about the Darts shooting blind on the approach. Yet in 'Lettersa from Pegasus' he states that he is going to take the Jumper out for Stealth mode for the pass through. So that makes me believe that it can't be done. Not because it's impossible, simply another case of Jumpers can't fire when cloaked, or you can't have the cloak & shield activated at the same time.

The writers have probably assumed that'd make it all too easy. So have placed some limitations on their abilities.

Although ones like 'Intruder', 'Duet' & 'Condemned' seem like fillers, where the show isn't going in a general direction. You have to remember that they have to space out the entire show. If every episode was about them attacking Wraith it'd get very old & the show wouldn't last very long. Simply because by the end of the second season it'd probably be finished & there would be nothing left.

So now that the Writers have sorted out the power problem, it's went back to general exploration. Which includes trying to gather new allies & technology in the process. Ahead there are a few upcoming eps that really have me excited & overall I like where the show is going. Especially when it gets more action orientated.

You forgot that in this episode, the "rescue" PJ goes through the gate cloaked ... so why couldn't it return while still cloaked? We also saw Weir's PJ was able to dial the gate while cloaked, so that can't force you to uncloak ....

All I was trying to get at for the episode stuff:
Have an episode like Seige III, and then have 2 or 3 other plot-oriented episodes after, to set up late-season stuff. THEN go ahead with the filler episodes. It seemd like they went right ahead to filler during "Intruder" which was the damn 2nd episode of the season!!

What rescue episode? I haven't ever seen a PJ come through or go through while still cloaked!

Dialling the Gate while cloaked wouldn't have any bearing on needing to go through while cloaked. The DHD is simply another system, while cloaked they can still use sensors/comms etc.

The problem with adding in the plot fillers later on is, this is always when the seasons begin to heat up. So putting them in then would really affect the ratings, as the fans would switch off in droves. The start of the season is always slow. Mostly though the reason that they are taking it slow is to allow people to get used to all of the changes that have taken place. Don't get me wrong I really want to see it starting to heat up as muchg as anyone else. However I'm wiling to wait as there are some good stuff coming up, in eps like 'Conversion', 'Instinct' which reveal a lot about the Wraith. 'The Lost Boys & 'The Hive', 'Critical Mass' & so on.

What about when Weir comes through the gate in the second PJ in this episode? I'm pretty sure they came through cloaked, as some of the prisoners were standing there and didn't notice anything come through. (I think I missed about a second of 2 of this scene, so I may have missed them cloaking when comming out of the gate ...)

The scene switches back to Atlantis.

Weir, Lorne & a couple of Marines are in the Jumper.

Lorne: Don't worry we'll find them.

Weir: I was hoping to negotiate a trade agreement, now I'm going to have to negotiate their release.

Lorne: We don't know that.

Weir then looks at Lorne & Nods hopefully.

Weir: Dial the gate but go to Stealth Mode the moment we're through.

Maj.Lorne then dials the gate & the scene switches to the planet. The Gate is seen activating. Then the Jumpers comes though immediately after & around a sec or two later is goes into Stealth mode. Two prisoners then run from the damaged PJ to get a look at the gate. They see nothing & look at each other bewildered.

Ah. See, I missed the second that they were on the other side of the gate and uncloaked. All I saw was a "cloaked" object, the EH ripple, and the prisoners shrugging when they didn't see anything.

All in all, this was probably my least favorite episode in Season 2, and maybe even for the entire Series. I just can't believe that the Puddlejumper which was designed to withstand energy blasts, and which can respond to the pilots mental commands, and with shield and cloaking technology, did not warn the pilot, nor did it engage any of it's defenses when a good old cannon-ball came along. And I could not believe how Shepard did almost nothing to take evasive action when the first shot was fired. That's like taking down a F-16 fighter with a slingshot! The whole episode lost all credibility for me after that.

When the Wraiths finally did attack the city, we should have seen some defensive capabilities. It seemed like they had some pretty advanced technologies. After all, a bunch of condemned prisoners could build a cannon that can take out a Puddlejumper. Maybe they should have ask those prisoners to build a bigger cannon to takeout the Hive ship.

TJ

This episode wasn't half bad. Ronan's acting needs work. It was an interesting episode, with Rodney trying to save his crew from certain death, jury rigging the puddle jumper to open the gate, and the moral dillema the local people faced. Do we allow all our people to be taken by the wraith, or give a percentage to the wraith in the guise of prisoners? Some would say the man in charge did the right thing.

I finally got to see this episode after the reairing of the first 6 episodes for this season this past Tuesday. I was so worried I wouldn't be able to view it til' next year...

I wonder what happened to the young woman that was trying to help Weir&Co.?

I also am hoping that the innocents on the mainland were able to get away somehow. When I first found out that the main negotiator had a Wraith at his table my first thoughts were, *That's just not right* I was quite shocked frankly when I first saw the beastly thing.

Hopefully, in the future these events and people and what happened to them will be resolved in a future episode. They sort of remind me of the Tollan for some reason...did any one else get that too?

Aquila the Ancient

Did anyone notice how after the gate had shut down when the prisoners escaped that Shep told Weir to dial Atlantis??? The Wraith could have detected the coordinates being in such close proximity to the gate. It would have been wiser to dial a different alpha site and let Weir know to meet back at Atlantis, following Shep's route via the alpha site after the Wraith left the Island. That way they could safely decloak out of sight of the Wraith to travel through the gate, to an address other than Altantis incase the Wraith detect stargate activity. That would be the proper way to cover their tracks and remain dead to the Wraith. That way as far as the wraith are concerned, those Jumpers did not come from Atlantis but another Lantian resistance, or perhaps the base of operations for those who fled Atlantis before it's destruction.

I actually quite liked this episode.
And it's good to see how some people can go against their people, get some morals and tell an outsider what was happening.
It was different to see how a civilisation can have an alliance with the wraith. but it seems to be like 'Storm' where Atlantis went to another world while that hurricane (or whatever it was called) and the Genii were there.

This was a good episode. It confused me as to how those explosives managed to damage the Jumper though, I though they more robust than that. The Wraith that appeared in the city was just sinister. I hope that he appears more often as we need a major Wraith character.
Teyla is pretty handy with those sticks, I wouldnt like to be on the recieving end of those. Did I hear McKay right when he said "Who do you think I am, McGuyver"?

This seemed like a lot of SG1 eps rolled into one....wasn't bad though. I loved Mckay saying 'Who do you think I am, Mcgyver?!'
I thought I'd guessed the plot for it as well but when it turned out they were in league with the Wraith I was quite surprised...(I know, I'm a bit slow). And a Wraith actually eating and having a conversation..yeugh. That was so creepy.

Here's goes:

CLICHE OF THE WEEK: There's a dystopic colony. Their leader is a puddle faced brute and a downtrodden lacky with a heart as good as gold that helps our heroes to fight the puddle faced brute. Something about the lacky reminded me of DJ Qualls.

CLICHE OF THE WEEK RUNNER UP: A utopian society with a secret to hide.

GOOD AGENT OF THE WEEK: Torri Higginson got some screen time. Except, it seemed a bit out of place for Weir to go along in this unknown situation when one team has already gone missing. I think she enjoyed having her muscle at her disposal. It probably made her feel like a Goa'uld goddess.

NEW BIOLOGY OF THE WEEK: When we meet the wraith, we learn they feed through their hands. We then wonder what they have mouths for. In 'The Gift' we learn that Wraith evolved from humans. They were kind of humans that were corrupted by the Wraith bug. That explains the first bit. Now we have Wraith enjoying food. Clearly they still have digestive systems, that are apparently redundant, because the Wraith dude clearly says that they get no nutrition from food and it only serves as amusement, much like Polos or Jaffa Cakes. Hey, I didn't say it was bad. I kind of like it.

CAPTAIN ARCHER OF THE WEEK: Hasn't Shepherd just sacrificed thousands of people in the city by allowing the condemned to escape? True, the condemned didn't deserve their fate, but then Shepherd was exchanging one injustice for another.

CHOPPY EDITING OF THE WEEK: Joel Goldsmith's collage job at the end made it seem like more needed to be said and this would be picked up next week, but it appears not.

ATLANTIS UNINTELLIGENCE OF THE WEEK: The condemned have already proven themselves hostile. Trotting at low altitude right over them without cloak or shield was rather blaze. Sure, we were all shocked they hadn't weapons that effective (and if SG has taught us anything it's that weapons need not be technologically sophisticated to be effective), but then the old they're-more-advanced-than-we-first-thought routine is hardly new. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me six times, shame on me.

MISFIT OF THE WEEK: Ronan's still not much of a team player. Shepherd is having to invest way too much time getting him to cooperate. This was the problem I mentioned last week and why I wasn't happy with his eagerness to snap him up. And when did Ronan agree to join the team? This was as mysterious as Teal'c's return.

Pants!

(I'm turning into quite the regular cynic, ain't I?)

Now, although my posts lack the hilarious logic (or the length) of glom's cynicscorner-esque posts, I'll still be sticking my little finger into all the niggling plotholes of the episode, and wiggling it around...until the pair of tights ("pantyhose" *teehee*) that is the show is riddled with innumerable ladders! Now, this is not because I dislike the show, in fact I'm quite the fan...it's just because I'm such a good fan that I'm able to (and feel the need to) rip it to shreds!

Let me see, where to begin? What was most preposterous about this episode? Could it be the (clearly) cheap-as-chips Puddle Jumper that ate dirt after a few indirect hits? Or was it the (clearly) confused Wraith, who seems more like a crafty businessman than a life-sucking harbinger of death? Perhaps it is the (clearly) folly-filled negotiating leader of our little expedition, who (clearly) became a little bit stir-crazy being stuck on Atlantis so long, and jumped at the chance to dive into the first unstable situation she could find!

Nay, I hereby name this week's Preposteriety of the Week to be: the (clearly) cheap-as-chips Wraith cruiser that was disabled by a single drone! Not quite as comical as when it was done in SG-1, but still hee-frickin'-larious! Congratulations Wraith cruiser; you're this week's PotW award winner! Fly the flag well!

Things I liked: the basic Alcatraz premise, the Wraith, despite his schizophrenia, the Wraith cruiser close-ups, the idea of fission from stable elements (I honestly hope something comes of this, and that it wasn't just plopped in as filler-babble), Teyla's ass-kicking.

Things I liked not: Ronan Dex, measly little cliche "I-didn't-do-it!" engineer, the FX of the Puddle Jumper being hit/crashing, Ronan Dex, the members of the alien race, Ronan Dex, Weir's inept negotiating.

Until next week: adieu!

[Edit] glom [/Edit]

This post has been edited by Parmenides: Nov 16th 2005, 5:01 PM