*annoyed grunt* do you have link?

Link to what? I do not know what TPTB have said. I do nto follow that. I was only imforming you as to what TPTB means. Also, I was adding in some logic that could follow from the end of the episode. Do you understand what I am saying as to why Mackay was hallucinating and Carter really couldn't have been in the PJ with him? Plus, I have never seen a girl put her clothes on as fast as Carter did ... not to mention they were miraculously dry the entire time. Therefore, figment of his imagination.

Ok, you want proof. The following is from an interview that Amanda Tapping (the actress who plays Carter) had with TV Guide magazine:

Look for Carter to appear when bumbling science nerd Rodney McKay (David Hewlett) conjures up his old foil to help him escape from a sinking Puddle Jumper. 'Basically, I appear as a hallucination ... I'm not really there,' Tapping explains.


The important bit is in red. Proof enough for you?

yeah ok, i thought you knew, but i wont just accept it like this, maybe someone can quote the original source of this information.
EDIT: Ok thank you Dafmeister, thats what i was looking for! But still i have doubts, i will write down my own theory about that in a minute

oooookay pls i BEG you read my posts more carefully:
NOW quoting myself.

you see? i did not say that it is the real carter but it is neither an halizunation, imho

This post has been edited by Deathcrow: Jan 9th 2006, 3:27 PM

So carter is sending holograms of herself, to places that even radio waves cannot reach, to help out in a situation she knows nothing about. Yup, sounds plausible to me. Not to mention she was in another galaxy when this was happening. Please provide a little more proof of your speculation before we are expected to eat it.

How can you possibly have doubts? TPTB have said she is a hallucination and so has Amanda Tapping. She is a hallucination, nothing more, nothing less.

Ok heres what i think about it:
What was the meaning of this whale in the episode?
As you may remember in this SG1 episode with carter where she was stuck in this nebular there was this theory that it may have been a scentient lifeform. I see many analogies in this ep and also in this case i suspect the whale of being a scentient being with mental/telepathic powers.

As you might remember shortly before Carter appears the whale bumps against the ship (initializes mental contact) and after that "disappears" (in my oppinion it follows him all the time).
May it be possible that it is able to read Rodneys mind and create a familiar "halizunation" for him to help him in this crisis? It instantly recoginzes the problems of rodney (always wants to be in control, doing something) and tries to give him a counterpoint, to help him relax and let others do the work.
We know that the ancients liked to study things, and maybe they chose this planet because of these whales, maybe they even helped them on their way to ascension, who knows.

Basically my idea is that Rodney isn't as intelligent as many people think after that episode: He is not that wise as he wishes to be (better than carter), but the whale-being gives him that feeling to encourage him. All these aspects of carter just dont find into Rodneys character and even supconsciously it would be very strange to have such a person in him. I just dont believe it.

If you think about this some more, everything makes a little bit more sense: For example, the whale swimming around the PuddleJumper: because they would never have been able to find it without the whale.
And i think this theory is very realistic because we have no idea about these beings and what they may be capable of. Was it just a curious wild animal or maybe more? Especially the whale is too much in the center of this episode (appears many times, they speak about these beings in the sea and that they dont know anything about them), which makes it possible that there is a bigger meaning behind it.

I hope you get my idea a little bit, and nothing against Amanda Tapping, but i think the actors cant always understand the deepest and smallest bits of an Episode and her statemenet "Basically [...] an Halucination" fits to my interpretation, just that it does not originate from Rodney but from a "higher" being, which wants to help him.

Edit: Again i have to apologize if my english is sometimes not very good or difficult to understand, please take your time to read a sentence more than one time if you are not sure about what i meant, instead of misunderstanding me. Thanks

This post has been edited by Deathcrow: Jan 9th 2006, 4:00 PM

Nope Death, just a hallucination, not as much room for speculation as Amanda's "Grace" episode.

That said, Amanda has managed to whip herself back into shape very quickly after her baby.

Va va voom

This post has been edited by bigjohn_1972: Jan 13th 2006, 1:41 AM

Death I like the ideal. We as humans give animals no credit for real intellegance. I like your ideal. I will have to rewatch the episode and see the timing of the appearance of the whale excetra.

I liked this episode a lot, and it gave me a new veiw on talking to yourself lol. It was pretty funny with Makay and Carter, and we got to see a new version of Makay, a nicer less arogent one.

*tinfoil hat on*

I wouldnt take AT's interview quote to be proof definitive that she was a hallucination. If the writers are holding back some ancient-type character (oma desala? perhaps she has just enough power and focus to be able to monitor and communicate with the human planes while keeping anubis at bay. She was more truly ascended than him, after all) to account for Grace and Grace Under Pressure, the actors may not know about it yet....how much do they really know? They just work on and see the scripts for the season thats in production, right?

And Mallozi et al might not want to tip their hand just yet on that...look what happened for Ripple Effect, just by letting slip that an "old friend" might return, people did their digging through casting notices and had pretty much nailed Fraiser as the surprise return, though Martouf slipped under the radar pretty effectively.

TPTB also said we'd be seeing the Furlings this season, didnt they? Now that we have capsules for most of the current season of SG1 and SGA, there doesnt seem to be much room to squeeze in a whole new race while still following the orii/wraith story arcs leading up to the big cliffhanger finales. Unless the Grace hallucinations ARE the furlings...

*remove tinfoil hat*

That being said, I wonder what it will be like when McKay sees Carter again for real. If she comes on as a recurring character in Atlantis, you know theres going to be that awkward scene where McKay sees her again and has to contend with the fact that he's basically admitted to himself that she's smarter than him. Or go into denial about it. McKay could go either way

And what happens when he accidentally lets it slip that she was his fantasy? Or will he come clean and confess it to her directly? Shepherd is going to get it out of him sooner or later, he heard McKay say that "Carter told me to increase the pressure" and he'll find out what that was all about. Either way, through McKay or Shepherd, Carter will find out that in his darkest hour, McKay just wanted her wet and topless, and the ribbing that shall ensue will be priceless giggle fodder

And what was that movie in the 80s with Phoebe Cates coming out of the pool and taking off her top, in that guys dream? I thought that synth-music shoulda been playing when Carter rose up out of the water and pushed her hair back. I'm sure its what the writers/director had in mind when shooting that scene. Too bad the show isnt still produced for Shotime or she might have taken her top off too, the first boob shot since Children of the Gods

You know what I'm going to say. This was already done on SG-1, what? Only 2 seasons ago? I didn't like the premise then, and I didn't like it now. Of all the people Rodney could have conjured, why'd he pick Sam? He could have picked an Ancient who built puddle jumpers. He could have picked Einstein. He could have picked Chuck Norris. But noooo. He picked Sam, who, by the way, did squat to help him. So she kept him calm. Big deal. So she showed her boobies and made out with him. Again, big fecking deal. All the knowledge was right there in Rodney's own brain, so why have Sam be the conduit through which he accessed this info? I know he's got a crush on her, but come on. I know he thinks she's smart, but PLEASE. We've been down this road before many times. Why not try something NEW for a change?

If it was me writing this episode, I'd have had him hallucinate Sheppard, you know, someone who's a true friend there to comfort and listen to him and nudge him in the right direction on occasion. But that's probably because I'm a slave to the McShep, which was done up nicely in this episode despite the fact that this was a rehashed "Grace" script. Same story, different packaging.

In the end, I liked the McShep, Zelenka, and the whale. That's it.

Wow okay...um...where to begin.

This episode was interesting. Mckay was great, it's a little hard to watch the show though when my dad and brother both hate mckay. I'm sitting there laughing to death at his humor, and the rest of the room...dead silence. Ah well, gotta love Mckay.

Yeah it was done in the SG-1 episode Grace. This was Grace...under pressure. Strange...But uh good episode. 7/10


Did anyone here see the preview for next episode!? I really would rather not have Captain Kirk on the show, but according to my brother...it's only one episode, and Sheppard doesn't get with every girl, every episode. I hope he's right, I hate it when they did that to Daniel in SG1.

This episode was awesome. I was laughing when Rod was arguing with himself. As for "why did he pick Carter?" Well, I kinda gots a theory about that but it's way out in left field. Does anybody remember the last episode Rod was on in SG-1? THe one where Carter kissed him goodbye?. Here is my thory, put yourself in his shoes for a minute. You are stuck in a puddle jumper all alone and not much chance of getting out of this. Would you have albert einstine with you or would you rather have a hot blonde who is equally smart as you if not smarter who you liked and has a great body?

I loved it when they were arguing. Also, when Shep came up with the idea, I know he isn't an idea man so to say but I kinda thought of Jack. I know, he isn't the smartest apple in the bunch but he does think in simple ways like shep. Just grab the thing and pull it out errr. And as for Rod's mind, I know I would have thought the same as with Carter. I'm glad to know at least one of them has the mind of a man. I wonder how many people watched that ep just cuz amanda was in it? Man, she is hot. Oh, and one last thing, if I were in Rods position when she was making out with him, I would have said "Screw the jumper"

i enjoyed this episode. "i should be the one on the surface trying to save the poor b*@#!&d stuck underwater, not BE the poor b*@#!&d stuck underwater!" LOL my major issue was that it was pretty similar to "Grace". only with a whale.

This episode was okay, I kinda stopped watching it for awhile because it really wasn't catching me. Surprised me too because I love McKay, he and Beckett are my two faves.

So, another Grace? Episodes like these remind me all to well of Cast Away. McKay is a nut, though, like Sam, he too learned some things about himself. Ha ha... like not being the retard that he is.

Anyway, I give it a 6/10.

Well, seeing as I have a "thing" for Rodney, that make out scene with Sam was um.... it was... I got a tickle in my tummy; a flutter of butterflys....

Aside from that, I could also totally relate to all the things he was going through as he was arguing with himself and yelling at the jumper; even though he recognized that it was an inanimate object. But I sometimes wish that swearing could be used in the script and just get bleeped out during air time. You know that any of us would have said "You are a piece of sh*t!" instead of "You are a piece of junk!" (when Rodney was yelling at the computer display/ jumper).

Mmmm good stuff.

That line did seem a little...weird. I know that they aren't allowed to say sh*t, but you'd think that they could of thought of something better than "junk". They could of said crap, or they could have had him start to say sh*t, but in the middle of him saying it, have that whale hit the jumper or something.

This post has been edited by Goa'uld: Jan 28th 2006, 11:45 PM

Really? I thought there was zero chemistry there and that was about the tamest kiss I've seen since 6th grade.

I liked the episode - though honestly, I thought AT was a bit off. If she was a hallucination, I think she should have cut loose from her "Sam" persona a bit and stretched her acting chops.

I don't know - I guess I was hoping she'd get a little radical, though maybe the water scene was supposed to answer to that. I wish her part had been written more as a mirror of Rodney's own snarkiness since after all...she was Rodney. I'd like to see Sam do snarky, arrogant, and self-involved! I enjoyed watching Rodney trying to wrap his head around the fact that he was arguing with his own sub-conscious and it was wearing pink.

This post has been edited by Sighfienerd: Jan 29th 2006, 2:16 AM

I was hoping that this was the end of Rodney.

I have not forgotten that his arrogance almost got Teal'c killed when Teal'c was stuck in the Stargate.

In my opinion, Rodney is the most annoying character in both Stargate Series.

Ohhh... can't you be nice to poor Rodney? He's taking his licks. I didn't like him much at first either but he's grown on me. He's being handed hard lessons on a stick. The point of this episode seemed to be about him letting someone else do the work and learning to listen to others. He's got to learn that as brilliant as he is he doesn't always have the answer. His own subconcious hallucination told him he was "petty, arrogant and bad with people".

Other than that, I liked this ep. Sure it's an sg-1 rehash but I like it better here. "Grace" was just so boring.What made this one for me was that Sheppard was first in line to save him despite valid strong objections. I, like Xay am a slave to the McShep and this episode had a lot of it, despite Rodney's ill-suited crush on Carter. Shep got to be the first one to get to him and he was ready to order Radek to go and would have if Weir hadn't guilted him into it.

Plus, I don't know what it is about the scene but I loved the part when Shep was knocking on Rodney's jumper. Anyone could've insisted they were right outside but the pounding added a little extra something that made it so Sheppard's style. Dunno why but I thought it was cute in that buddy kind of way and I got a good laugh out of it.

How long ago did that happen? It is almost 5 years since '48 Hours'. McKay has grown as a character since then. He has turned into the best character in Atlantis.

Perhaps there was no real chemistry, but Mckay seemed totally into it; and I was convinced.

He's cute when he's vulnerable and under the spell of a seductive halluncination.


Ooooo! That would be cool. Sam has always been so humble when it comes to her accomplishments. Surely some of that ability of hers has to go to her head...


Yeah I thought that was funny too.

Did it strike anyone else as convenient that they could use their shield to envelope the other jumper to get Rodney out? And why didn't it occur to them sooner?

Was it just me or was there a parts where the carter hallucination physically interacts with the world around her? Besides her walking around the water and causing splashes, especially when she rises out of the water after she undresses, wasn't there an earlier part where a cable dangling from the ceiling rests over her shoulder unmoving, and she moves it while she turns? Hallucinations can't do that, unless he developed some kind of telekinesis, .

At least for the most part they didn't have her moving much, and they didn't show below her waist most of the time(or when they did they usually had the camera angled below the waterline so you couldn't see what the water moving around). But the couple of times when you could see her moving things around her looked awkward to me, because if she isn't there then there is no way those things should have been affected by her at all.

Reminds me of the joke in SG-1 "Wormhole X-treme" where they ask the question if a device would allow you to walk through walls, why don't the people using the devices fall through the floor?

This post has been edited by Valiento: Jan 29th 2006, 8:47 PM